Rocky Horror Picture Show (Normal / Proper Aspect?)

[Ryan Gallagher]

This question is going to expose that I have not been doing this very long, as every projectionist worth their salt has probably shown this numerous times.

But what aspect ratio to expect/present with a 35mm print? I assume it will be the theatrical 1.85 release print... but is it open matte to permit a 1.66 showing?

I've had both 1.85 and 1.66 come across my booth in DCP form. And 1.66 is cited as intended, and can often be found on BluRays marketed as ironically, "widescreen edition", in addition to all streaming versions hosted appearing to be 1.66 too.
I ask cause in order to do 1.66 proper here, we will need to beg, borrow, or invest in a couple lenses. I feel like RHPS fans would notice any inappropriate middle ground?

I'll find out more when I have the print, but it might be a little tight to source lenses after that.

[Travis Cape]

1.85. There are microphones above the wedding scene.

[Ryan Gallagher]

1.85. There are microphones above the wedding scene.

Noted. However the internet seems to regard that one as more of a crew mistake, and not a product of viewing a non-intended aspect ratio:
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0073629/goofs/

[Travis Cape]

It doesn’t matter, it’s RHPS. If you only have lenses for 1.85 go with it.

[Randy Stankey]

Y'know... Most of the people who go to watch that movie are so drunk, stoned or both that they'll hardly notice what ratio the screen is in.

Just use your best, professional judgement. Pre-screen the movie and double check that you got your framing and masking right.
After that, just let 'er roll and make sure you've got extra cleaning crew scheduled for after the show.

[Ryan Gallagher]

Yeah Yeah I know it's RHPS, who cares. Taking the easy option with lensing available is probably advised. Chances of the print not being actual garbage is pretty slim.

But it is also the 50th Anniversary..... So just contemplating best possible presentation etc. We don't do the full mess here, not shadow casted. They can shout and sing along but none of the thrown props etc. They are pretty good about behaving in my 3 years showing it here (as DCP), it's definitely roudy, but not messy.

Really I'm also fishing for an excuse to make the venue get a set of 1.66 lensing, cause we need it anyway for more serious films. Perhaps the "who cares" nature of RHPS isn't the best film to attempt to wedge that issue.

[Ed Gordon]

This question is going to expose that I have not been doing this very long, as every projectionist worth their salt has probably shown this numerous times.

But what aspect ratio to expect/present with a 35mm print? I assume it will be the theatrical 1.85 release print... but is it open matte to permit a 1.66 showing?...

It seems to be open matte, but in addition to the mention of 1.66 at IMDB, the Bluray releases are masked to 1.66 as well. There was a laserdisk released at 1:33.

This is a Domesday capture of the USA Laserdisc release for Rocky Horror Picture Show, catalog reference 1974-80. This particular release presents the film in a 1.33:1 aspect ratio, also known as Open Matte ratio.

Source: https://archive.org/details/RHPS-Ope...04-57_ffv1.mkv

The source link above has a 56 minute extract from the laserdisk release you can watch.

[Randy Stankey]

I don't think that, because it's an old, crummy movie that people shouldn't care. It's just that a projectionist can spend so much time fretting over details that he forgets why he's doing his job.

A projectionist does his job so that other people can relax and have fun for two hours. He's not there to inspect every last inch of the film. That's somebody else's job.
Of course, a projectionist wants to do his job well but there comes a time when he has to say he's spent enough time preparing and, now, it's time to show the movie.

You are in a privileged position where you have access to the machines and can make adjustments. The customer just wants to watch the damn movie. As long as the film runs and nothing is messed up, most people aren't going to get out a tape measure, measure the screen and calculate the aspect ratio down to six decimal places.

Like I said, be a professional but you don't have to sweat the small stuff.

[Gordon McLeod]

The original mag prints were full frame and were shown at 1.85:1

[Ryan Gallagher]

It seems to be open matte, but in addition to the mention of 1.66 at IMDB, the Bluray releases are masked to 1.66 as well. There was a laserdisk released at 1:33.

Source: https://archive.org/details/RHPS-Ope...04-57_ffv1.mkv

The source link above has a 56 minute extract from the laserdisk release you can watch.

There is actually a second file in that playlist, whole movie is on Archive.org in OpenMatte. LOL, 1.33 was certainly never intended! Why would the LD version do that? The wedding boom mic is not just a tip and a shadow, but an entire microphone! (at the 7:00 min mark)

OpenMatte_Wedding_Mic.jpg

But cheers for the resource. Kinda rare to have an open matte reference online, might as well look. Found another strike against 1.33 (not that I was considering it). If I wanted to decide my plan on 1.66 vs 1.85 way ahead that copy is enough to do it. Cheers for the link.

A real no-no for 1.33 (in my mind) is this sequence at 50:50 ish where there is a planned reveal of Rocky, but in the prior setup shot they would have awkwardly left just his heel in frame, I expect out of frame in 1.66 and 1.85 as intended.

OpenMatte_RockyFoot.jpg

Later, as they return to that framing and pull back mid reveal:

OpenMatte_RockyFeet.jpg

[Jim Cassedy]

most people aren't going to get out a tape measure, measure the
screen and calculate the aspect ratio down to six decimal places.

... but there's always THAT one guy . . .
lol!

[Ryan Gallagher]

Part of me wonders if the open matte framing gained some popularity in cinemas BECAUSE of the shadow casted nature of these shows. I've seen clips where some casts have performed on a stage with a screen that goes all the way to the stage floor (probably a cyc and not a film screen), To keep the important film action more above the live cast heads, you could take the open matte approach. Or at least that would be one method.

In comparing 1.66 and 1.85 framing using the archive.org resource, both work reasonably well, (outside of our church microphone friend making a slight appearance in 1.66), but 1.85 feels extremely tight with the end title name cards. 1.66 felt correct there. But it's all academic, It doesn't seem 1.66 lenses are in my future this year, so 1.85 theatrical release ratio it is, which these days, might actually be the *rare* presentation considering the modern digital is 1.66 in most home media formats, cited many places as an upgrade format choice over the pan and scan that was needed before widescreen TVs. Hence why it got titled "Widescreen Edition".

[Ryan Gallagher]

Amusingly, it seems us booking the print for our summer film series is a bit guilty of "early celebration", as the 4K Restoration 50th Anniversary edition hits cinemas and shelves in October, complete with cast roadshow tours. October is a good choice of course.

https://playbill.com/article/origina...-north-america

I'll be curious to see what aspect ration that Disney DCP contains.

[Leo Enticknap]

Believe it or not, the only medium in which I've ever projected this movie is 16mm; but several times, over the years. I guess the boom mikes must have been visible unless the prints were panned and scanned. The occasion that sticks in my mind most of all is when I was a student in the late '80s. The Students' Union was by that time running its Monday evening movie shows mainly on VHS and a three-tube CRT projector, but every now and again had to play a 16mm print, because that was all they could get. That was where I came in, because I was the only person on campus who was a trained film projectionist and was willing to be there in the evenings. The projector was a Fumeo xenon-lit machine, thankfully in a locked booth at the back of the lecture theatre, because the Rocky Horror screenings were full of extremely drunk people who weren't exactly behaving like your regular movie audience. I think I can safely recall that they wouldn't have cared if boom mikes were visible.

The other show I remember from those days was Reservoir Dogs, which was banned on VHS in the UK until the late '90s because of a reactionary political response to the ear chopping scene. I ran that on 16mm 'scope in the same booth several times, to audiences that at least were able to remain seated throughout the movie!

[Ryan Gallagher]

I wasn’t thinking about 16mm editions, but that kinda makes sense having watched some of the open matte, far fewer frame inclusions than I would expect, sets built to full heights including ceiling elements that would not be seen otherwise.

if I had to wager, might say it was shot for all 3 aspects, with maybe a slight tendency towards 1.66 being the “best” viewing subjectively, but knowing it would be released as flat, and also see 16mm printings. But they did put out pan-scan versions too, so if 1:33 was ever truly permissible, that signal was lost in the noise of early home distribution.