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Author Topic: PayPal/eBay policies are getting ridiculous... Tony Bandiera Jr Film God Posts: 3067 From: Moreland Idaho Registered: Apr 2004 posted 05-11-2010 05:46 PM                     Any one else here noticed how bad eBay and now Paypal's policies have become? (Paypal was bought out by eBay.) I got an email from Paypal today which has me astounded to say the least. In summary, what it says is that from now on, Paypal is going to place a HOLD on ALL payments made to my account, until THEY verify that an item I sold was received AND satisfactory to the buyer. This hold can be up to 21 days!! They will base delivery on tracking info (but ONLY if you do shipping thru Paypal's shipping links, but even then the hold lasts 3 days AFTER delivery confirmation.) Otherwise they can hold the money (on eBay transactions) UNTIL the buyer gives POSITIVE feedback!! After 9 years of 100% positive transactions thru eBay (and several thru here) I find this extremely insulting and I am looking into seeing if it violates any fair commerce laws. Especially since eBay now no longer allows any other wire transfer methods. (AND WILL SOON MAKE PAYPAL THE ONLY PAYMENT METHOD A BUYER CAN USE!! Which means no more check/money order payments allowed either.) I see an anti-trust/monopoly lawsuit in eBay/Paypal's future. As for eBay, if you review their latest user Agreement, you will discover that as a SELLER (who PAYS FEES to sell items which is subtracted from your sale price of an item) you have NO RIGHTS or course of action in the event of negative feedback given without due cause. ANY buyer can leave a negative feedback BEFORE an item is even received and as a seller all you can do in response is leave a 50-character comment in reply. Formerly, there was at least a written note that buyers were to try to resolve issues prior to leaving negative feedback. Oh, and as a seller your option to leave NEGATIVE feedback to a BUYER has been removed. Overall I think I am done with eBay and may well be done with Paypal as well, if they don't immediately recind that policy on my account at least. Anyone else here who uses Paypal should check their account and see if they are also facing that policy. And if anyone else was sent that policy update I'd like to hear from you either here or by PM.  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 05-11-2010 06:11 PM                     I'd be more inclined to be amenable to that policy if they paid interest during the month that my money was not available to me for withdrawal. I didn't say I'd completely agree with it. I just said I'd be more inclined to agree. Depends on the rate.  |  IP: Logged Tony Bandiera Jr Film God Posts: 3067 From: Moreland Idaho Registered: Apr 2004 posted 05-11-2010 06:20 PM                     Randy, to a point I agree with you, but Paypal's rate is BELOW what a regular savings account is.. and the key point is that THEY decide when/if the buyer is happy. There is a LOT of sellers on eBay right now (including a lot of "Power Sellers") that are getting ready to jump ship. The fees have gone up, sellers have NO WAY of leaving negative feedback to buyers who either don't pay or otherwise lie and leave negatives, and eBay is soon going to make Paypal (which THEY own) THE ONLY WAY you can pay for items. Overall it is no longer good business practice to do anything with either company anymore. There is too much risk involved.  |  IP: Logged Mike Blakesley Film God Posts: 12767 From: Forsyth, Montana Registered: Jun 99 posted 05-11-2010 07:22 PM                        I doubt they're trembling in their boots too much. Whenever "a lot" of customers of a company like that jump ship, the true number is probably somewhere below 1% or so.  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 05-11-2010 08:08 PM                     There might not be a great exodus of people away from eBay but I know there is a steady stream of them. Over time, if they can't attract more people than they lose, their business will shrink. I know for fact that there are groups of people who make arts and crafts that do not use eBay. My wife happens to collect Teddy Bears. She has quite a few of them. When I want to get her a hand made, one-of-a-kind, artist Teddy Bear I often get them from people who sell them on-line. Of the people I know who make Bears for adoption, quite a few of them will NOT have anything to do with eBay. There is a site called "Etsy" (www.etsy.com) where you can get hand made arts and crafts. There is another site called "Bear Pile" (www.bearpile.com) where you can find over 100 Teddy Bear artists who sell through that site. Many of them will not sell on eBay. When you are hunting for collectibles like Bears, you have to know where to go to find them. And, no, I don't mean the interest rate you get from PayPal for keeping your money there. I mean interest over and above that due to the fact that it is your money but you are not in control of it until a later time. They should pay you for that. I do not keep a balance at PayPal. I have a special ATM card, separate from my regular account which I use only for on-line purchases, etc. I keep a $100 balance in that account just for good measure. If somebody breaks in to that account, the most they'll ever get is $100. That is the card I keep on file for PayPal. Also, I only keep a $20 balance in PayPal at any given time. If I need to buy something from PayPal, I transfer money into the account using my special ATM card. If I take a payment through PayPal, I will either spend the balance down or I will transfer the money out. PayPal is certainly convenient but, more and more, they are becoming a necessary evil. I want to maintain as little exposure to them as possible. My main problem with them is that they are, in essence, what amounts to an unregulated bank. Basically, they could walk away with everybody's money tomorrow and there isn't a thing the government can do about it. Think about it. PayPal is almost as bad as Bernie Madoff.  |  IP: Logged Marc Hansen Film Handler Posts: 93 From: Seattle, WA, USA Registered: Dec 2000 posted 05-11-2010 09:28 PM                     For a year or so I have been using Ebid.net. VERY seller friendly and growing fairly fast.  |  IP: Logged Jeremy Weigel Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1062 From: Edmond, OK, USA Registered: Mar 2007 posted 05-12-2010 02:05 AM                     I have been an eBay member since 1997, but I haven't used eBay to sell stuff for several years. A friend of mine has a used computer business and has told me how horrible it has gotten to sell his stuff on eBay over the past 2-3 years. He recently had a transaction where a buyer never sent payment, so he filed a non-paying bidder complaint. eBay found in his favor, credited his seller fees back and issued a strike against the buyer. The buyer then left him negative feedback which ruined his perfect score! He then called eBay to have the feedback removed, but was told they couldn't do that even though the feedback was obviously retaliation for the non paying bidder strike. I think a lot of the policy changes eBay has recently made stems from litigation. Most of which is likely coming from dissatisfied buyers, hence the over reaction by eBay in skewing its policies in favor of the buyer which is a shame.  |  IP: Logged Joshua Waaland Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 800 From: Cleveland, Ohio Registered: Dec 1999 posted 05-12-2010 10:49 AM                     I too am getting sick of the ebay regulations. They are definitely skewing their regulations in favor of the buyer and sellers have no recourse or protection. The fees alone are f-ing ridiculous! I still buy stuff on there but sell a lot less than I ever did. I also have started free offsite hosting of my photos so I don't have to pay ebay for posting those too. I listed a lawn tractor on there recently but ended the auction early when the guy came to look at it and bought it with cash. He tried signing up for Paypal and got fed up with it and just paid cash. It was nice too to finally screw ebay over by ending the auction early and not paying their stupid final value fees.  |  IP: Logged Mark Hajducki Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 500 From: Edinburgh, UK Registered: May 2003 posted 05-12-2010 01:52 PM                     There seems to be a very big difference between ebay and Gumtree (The UK version of ebay classified Ads) which does not charge, nor require registration except for top placement. When used for large items such as furniture or property rental the local limitation does not cause problems.  |  IP: Logged Joshua Waaland Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 800 From: Cleveland, Ohio Registered: Dec 1999 posted 05-12-2010 02:37 PM                     We have craigslist.com over here that is much like what you are describing but it's mostly local buyers. This drastically narrows the market when you are selling film equipment or related things.  |  IP: Logged Tony Bandiera Jr Film God Posts: 3067 From: Moreland Idaho Registered: Apr 2004 posted 05-12-2010 02:50 PM                     Marc, thank you for the link. I have registered an account there and will start doing all my online auction biz there. eBay and Paypal can go themselves. I am tired of the endless fees and from them and having no protection as a seller. Joshua, check out ebid..I think you'll find it a lot better value overall. Even signing up for the "Seller Plus" is FAR cheaper that the fees on eBay!! (Last month selling THREE items I paid out $70.00 in eBay fees, NOT including the fees Paypal charged for the payments sent to me. The LIFETIME Seller Plus is only $79.) Plus there are NO reserve or most other fees, and the Final Value fee is only 3% as opposed to 7-8%. Jeremy, eBay's problem is that they HAVEN'T been hit with litigation which is only a matter of time. Their former CEO should hear of what has happened to the company she had run so well.  |  IP: Logged Bruce Hansen Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 847 From: Stone Mountain, GA, USA Registered: Dec 1999 posted 05-12-2010 05:38 PM                     Ebay only letting you use PayPal (which they own), that sure sounds like an anti-trust problem to me. Maybe it's time to report this to the Justice Department. It sounds a lot like Microsoft requiring you to use Outlook Express. This turned into a world wide mess, and Microsoft LOST everywhere.  |  IP: Logged Mitchell Dvoskin Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1869 From: West Milford, NJ, USA Registered: Jan 2001 posted 05-12-2010 06:05 PM                     eBay will allow you to use other credit card processors besides PayPal. The problem is you must use a credit card processor, and for a small amount of transactions, most are more expensive than PayPal.  |  IP: Logged Tony Bandiera Jr Film God Posts: 3067 From: Moreland Idaho Registered: Apr 2004 posted 05-12-2010 09:13 PM                     Bruce, you are right, maybe it is time to have the JD take a look at their operations.... Mitchell, they currently allow other card processes, the PayPal only is coming soon. (AFAIK no date has been announced formally yet.) In any event they are heading into a monopoly situation which is not a good business model at least and criminal at worst. Either way they are schmucks and deserve to fail for screwing over the people who generate the income, the sellers!!  |  IP: Logged Jeremy Weigel Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1062 From: Edmond, OK, USA Registered: Mar 2007 posted 05-12-2010 10:19 PM                     I do seem to remember reading several articles of pending litigation against eBay for their feedback system. I think most of it involved European users though.  |  IP: Logged

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