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Author Topic: Buying a New Tripod
Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 10-02-2009 10:37 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I'm fixing to buy a new tripod. An expensive one. I know at least a few long time FT members are pretty serious about photography. So I'm looking for some feedback on this decision.

My current tripod is a carbon fiber model made by Hakuba. It cost $300 new and has worked well in general use for the past several years. It's light, small, convenient. I'll probably keep it as a backup of sorts.

However, this Hakuba model just doesn't cut it anymore in terms of stability for some of the photography stuff I've been doing lately, such as creating long exposure HDR images. This tripod has a little too much play in it for 21 megapixel images to register precisely, especially with Oklahoma winds as a factor.

After doing a lot of photography store browsing and reading, I have my new tripod choice narrowed down to two models made by Gitzo: the GT3530LS and GT5541LS.

Any FT members own a Gitzo tripod, particularly one of these models?

I'm almost sold on the GT3530LS model. It costs a little over $700. The tripod has no potentially wobbly, flexing rapid rising column, although you can add one if you like since this is a "systematic" model. The tripod comes standard with a flat plate that can hold a ball head, gimbal head, platform for a laptop computer or other accessories.

BUT $700 is a lot of money to spend on a tripod. If you're willing to spend that much on a tripod, especially one that doesn't even come with the head to hold the camera, then what's another $200 for Gitzo's even better 5-series model?

That's where I have to consider the GT5541LS. It's bigger. It weighs 6.5 pounds instead of the 4 lbs of the 3 series model I mentioned. And that's not counting the additional weight of the ball head or gimbal head you attach to it. It's rated to hold the biggest super telephoto lenses made by Canon and Nikon. But then I hear about people using those same giant sized lenses on Gitzo 3-series tripods. So I have to wonder if spending the extra $200 is overkill.

Ultimately, I want to buy this tripod and not have to fart around with buying another tripod for many years. Gitzo has limited lifetime warranties on their products. If I'm going to buy an expensive tripod I want to get the right one the first time instead of having to spend upwards of $1000 a couple years down the road when I can plant a 400mm f/2.8 on the thing.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 10-02-2009 11:37 PM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
What is HDR? Are you taking super long exposure pictures at the most extreme of the telephoto range or something? My tripod doesn't seem to have any movement. It jiggles when I focus the lens, but after I leave it alone, it stops. Pictures are no more blurry than if I just set the camera down on the table with a wide angle lens and set it on a 2 second delay. You're a peeping tom, aren't you? You are trying to take pictures of nekkid people in windows from miles away, right?

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 10-03-2009 05:34 AM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Need a link...

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 10-03-2009 08:35 AM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I still use my old wooden leg tripod with a connor head on it
weight I find translates into stability

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Randy Stankey
Film God

Posts: 6539
From: Erie, Pennsylvania
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 10-03-2009 09:42 AM      Profile for Randy Stankey   Email Randy Stankey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Joe Redifer
What is HDR?
High Dynamic Range photography.

You take two, three or more exposures of the same scene with bracketed exposures, at least two stops apart. Then you use Photoshop, et. al. to combine the exposures into one image.

The smaller stops (higher ƒ-number) capture detail in the highlight areas but lose detail in the shadows. The larger stops (lower ƒ-number) capture detail in the shadow areas but get "blown out" in the highlight areas.

Creating an HDR composite allows one image to have the best of both worlds. You can really get some great photographs with it if you know what you're doing.

However, you need a tripod that's rock steady if you want the best results. While Photoshop can interpolate between photos that have small amounts of movement between exposures, the best results are achieved when there is little or no movement. Higher resolution photos like Bobby's become even MORE critical because of the number of pixels. A good, solid tripod is a must.

If it was me, I'd buy just the camera head and figure out a way to mount it on my own, homemade contraption made from 1-1/2" iron pipe and Kee-Klamps with the feet weighted down with 5 lb. barbell weights. "Weider" barbell weights should slide right over the ends of the pipes.

Oh! You want portability? Oops! My bad! [Wink]

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Frank Angel
Film God

Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 10-03-2009 10:16 AM      Profile for Frank Angel   Author's Homepage   Email Frank Angel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I'm with you Randy -- strap the head to a Simplex pedestal and be done with it. Oh yah, portable -- put wheels on the pedestal. [Big Grin]

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 10-03-2009 10:50 AM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Here is a link from Adobe on HDR.

Lately Dolby has been involved in developing HDR technology for LCD TV displays and other applications. This must be some long-term, forward-looking process since there are currently no video cameras or video playback formats that support 96-bit HDR color.

quote: Joe Redifer
Are you taking super long exposure pictures at the most extreme of the telephoto range or something? My tripod doesn't seem to have any movement. It jiggles when I focus the lens, but after I leave it alone, it stops. Pictures are no more blurry than if I just set the camera down on the table with a wide angle lens and set it on a 2 second delay.
My tripod (a Hakuba Carbon HG-503mx) is sturdy enough when I'm shooting single photos. Taking multiple shots and merging them together exposes this tripod's design weaknesses. The images are couple or so pixels off from each other. That's not great if you're taking evening shots of cityscapes. You get ghosting around street lights and other annoying nonsense.

I'm shooting these photos with the mirror locked to avoid mirror slap. And I'm remotely controlling the camera by tethering it via USB to a notebook computer. Tethering is also recommended for HDR imaging because most cameras auto bracket no more than 2 stops. That may not be enough of a difference for some shots. Some HDR images may be derived from several shots. Anyway, the camera and tripod is not being touched at all. Still, movement is happening. That leaves the tripod as the culprit for what's throwing off the images.

A lot of less expensive tripods have 3-way heads with cork built into the platform. That stuff can flex. So I'm getting a very good ball head and camera L-plate instead. That Hakuba tripod has carbon fiber legs, but I don't think they're sturdy enough to dampen out all vibrations and I suspect they flex a bit in the wind. Gitzo puts 6 layers of carbon fiber into their tripod legs. Their tripods have other design features to eliminate twisting and flexing. I just have to decide if I want to spend $725 or $950 for one.

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Bill Enos
Film God

Posts: 2081
From: Richmond, Virginia, USA
Registered: Apr 2000


 - posted 10-03-2009 11:56 AM      Profile for Bill Enos   Email Bill Enos   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
There isn't $700 worth of anything in a truck load of tripods. Even the most expensive get loose after a couple years of just moderate use.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 10-03-2009 03:24 PM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
You must ask yourself if $700+ is worth it to take these photos. If there is only a couple of pixels difference in Photoshop, move one layer over a couple of pixels and crop it. There might be a few pixels here and there that won't perfectly match, but trust me, people will not notice.

Bobby, you should start a photography thread or something where people post their shiz (re: pics).

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Randy Stankey
Film God

Posts: 6539
From: Erie, Pennsylvania
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 10-03-2009 03:37 PM      Profile for Randy Stankey   Email Randy Stankey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
If you're doing photography for pay you'll make the $700 back. If photography is your hobby and you don't mind spending the money, it could be worth it. But think about what other things that you could spend 700 clams on compared to the use you would get out of it.

I don't know those tripods very well but that's how I would decide on whether to spend the money.

For me, the decision came down to whether to buy a bicycle or the parts to complete my AR-15. I thought about it and decided that it would be better to get healthy than to buy guns. I can always buy the gun later.

In retrospect, maybe I should have bought the damn rifle! [Wink]

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Claude S. Ayakawa
Film God

Posts: 2738
From: Waipahu, Hawaii, USA
Registered: Aug 2002


 - posted 10-03-2009 03:51 PM      Profile for Claude S. Ayakawa   Author's Homepage   Email Claude S. Ayakawa   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I still have an old Bogen tripod I had used for many years that served me very well when I used to do my environmental portrait photography with a Hassleblad camera and long lenses during my film days. Now that I only shoot in digital with a DSLR Nikon D200 camera, I usually shoot my portraits either hand held or with a Manfrotto monopod that had cost me about $200.00. I had never spent more than four hundred dollars for a tripod during all my forty three year photographic career.

-Claude

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Paul Mayer
Oh get out of it Melvin, before it pulls you under!

Posts: 3836
From: Albuquerque, NM
Registered: Feb 2000


 - posted 10-03-2009 04:45 PM      Profile for Paul Mayer   Author's Homepage   Email Paul Mayer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I used to have a Gitzo (don't remember the model number) and indeed it was a fine heavy tripod. Gitzo is good stuff.

Like Claude, I too have a Bogen which has served me well since the late '80s for shoots where I used an old Mamiya 645. I think the Bogen is a good bang-for-the-buck tripod, though it might not be good enough for the kind of work Bobby is talking about.

By the way, all of my old now-out-of-production, film-based shooting gear is up for sale. Just need to cut down on the junk level in my storage. Inquire within... [Wink]

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 10-03-2009 06:00 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The numbering scheme for Gitzo tripod models is pretty confusing, which is why Gitzo has a product key in their catalogs and web site explaining all the numbers and letters.

There's lot of others models similar to the GT3530LS and GT5541LS, but with different features. Those two models are similar to each other in that they have removable flat base plates and no center rapid rising column. The 3-series model has 3 sections per leg whereas the 5-series model has 4 sections per leg, is significantly larger and heavier. The GT5541LS is beefy enough to hold some of the heaviest camera/lens combinations. The GT3530LS is no slouch either, but the GT5541LS is even more stable.

quote: Joe Redifer
Bobby, you should start a photography thread or something where people post their shiz (re: pics).
Sounds like a good idea, although I thought the random pictures thread served kind of the same purpose. Still, the 550 pixel width limit for uploaded images kind of limits what one can show.

quote: Claude S. Ayakawa
I had never spent more than four hundred dollars for a tripod during all my forty three year photographic career.
Depending on the year you spent $400 on a tripod, that $400 purchase might be equivalent to something costing well more than double the price now.

The US dollar has lost at least 1/3 of its value in just the last 10 years. One example of dollar devaluation: the dollar versus the Japanese Yen. When my family first moved to Japan in the late 1970s the exchange rate was around ¥350 for $1. Now $1 is worth ¥89. Dollar devaluation is one reason why Sony has lost so much money selling the Playstation 3 and why the price cut to $299 may be really painful. The rumor mill is buzzing about Canon possibly raising its prices by more than 10% as a response to what the dollar is doing.

quote: Randy Stankey
If you're doing photography for pay you'll make the $700 back. If photography is your hobby and you don't mind spending the money, it could be worth it. But think about what other things that you could spend 700 clams on compared to the use you would get out of it.
The only other big ticket purchase I've been considering lately is a new 7.1 channel audio-video receiver. With HDMI 1.4 debuting next year, I'm holding off on that. My current Yamaha receiver is 10 years old, but still works just fine.

I do some paid photography work on occasion and am looking at this tripod purchase as one of the pieces of equipment needed to help me make more money. Photography as a hobby alone can be very expensive, especially if you want to pursue something like nature photography.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 10-03-2009 06:26 PM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Bobby Henderson
Sounds like a good idea, although I thought the random pictures thread served kind of the same purpose. Still, the 550 pixel width limit for uploaded images kind of limits what one can show.
Agreed. Maybe a dedicated photography thread with links to pics hosted offsite? The random picture thread is supposed to be mostly humorous, I think. Either way, I'd really like to discuss photography with others here and see examples of everyone's work as well.

Also, what does HDMI 1.4 offer that would be advantageous? Might as well wait for HDMI 1.4a or even HDMI 1.5.

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 10-03-2009 06:57 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The main things electronics companies will market regarding HDMI 1.4 is full color 3D capability and support for higher video resolutions, such as 4K. HDMI 1.4 supports much higher bandwidth and a greater variety of color space standards. The biggest improvement I see with the standard is support for Ethernet over HDMI. With the way a lot of home theater equipment is becoming ever more connected to the Internet, getting LAN functions on the same cable carrying audio and video seems like a pretty neat idea.

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