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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Community   » Film-Yak   » Adding acetone to your gas to get better milage (Page 1)

 
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Author Topic: Adding acetone to your gas to get better milage
Stephen Frazza
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 161
From: Nutley, NJ, USA
Registered: Mar 2004


 - posted 09-02-2005 12:55 AM      Profile for Stephen Frazza   Author's Homepage   Email Stephen Frazza   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
After reading the gas prices in your area posts I decided to share this.

Acetone in Gas
Readily-available chemical added to gas tank in small proportion improves the fuel's ability to vaporize completely by reducing the surface tension that inhibits vaporization of some fuel droplets.

Now i've been doing this for about 2 months and I say it definately works.
I live about 30 miles from work, and the amount of gas that it took for to me to just get to work or back was a little less than an eighth of a tank.
Now I can make the round trip using slightly more than it took me for one way before.
I have a 2000 Jeep Cherokee and have done nothing diferently to explain this better gas milage to.

So I suggest trying it out especially with the way gas prices are going up right now.

[ 09-02-2005, 01:41 PM: Message edited by: Stephen Frazza ]

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Bill Enos
Film God

Posts: 2081
From: Richmond, Virginia, USA
Registered: Apr 2000


 - posted 09-02-2005 01:29 AM      Profile for Bill Enos   Email Bill Enos   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
No way a little acetone is going to nearly half fuel consumption. Drive 1000 miles without the stuff, recording accurately fuel added to the tank during the period, then repeat while adding acetone, bet there is no measurable difference.

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Robert Burtcher
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 194
From: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
Registered: Jun 2005


 - posted 09-02-2005 02:48 AM      Profile for Robert Burtcher   Email Robert Burtcher   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I'm not so sure this actually works. I tried it and my gas mileage actually decreased. I think I put too much in though.

Stephen, keep accurate records of your fuel purchases and write down the exact mileage every time you fill up. Use that to calculate your gas mileage instead of watching your fuel gage... Gauges are NOT accurate. They are only intended to give you an estimate of how much fuel you have left. If you do that, then you'll know for sure if you're really getting any improvement from acetone in the tank. If you can crunch the numbers over a couple of tanks, let us know if you're actually seeing an improvement.

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Darryl Spicer
Film God

Posts: 3250
From: Lexington, KY, USA
Registered: Dec 2000


 - posted 09-02-2005 03:08 AM      Profile for Darryl Spicer     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I wouldn't do it if I still had any warrenty left on the powertrain of the car. Doing so will void it.

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Monte L Fullmer
Film God

Posts: 8367
From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
Registered: Nov 2004


 - posted 09-02-2005 03:47 AM      Profile for Monte L Fullmer   Email Monte L Fullmer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Now, isn't acetone quite a corrosive substance that could eat and corrode just about anything in sight that isn't stable to handle such a substance?

Like cutting your nose off just to spite your face?
(Here is the corrected link below. The earlier link had one too many "http's" in the URL...)

Acetone page

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Robert Burtcher
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 194
From: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
Registered: Jun 2005


 - posted 09-02-2005 03:52 AM      Profile for Robert Burtcher   Email Robert Burtcher   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Uhh... Fuel additives will not void a new vehicle warranty UNLESS:
  • The additive causes physical damage, or
  • The additve adversely affects the emissions or the emissions system.
Acetone IS corrosive to many cheap plastics, but it does not harm most common metals such as steel or aluminum... If you dump a few gallons of acetone in the gas tank, then expect physical damage to the fuel injectors or other plastic parts in the fuel system. However, at the extremely low concentrations of acetone present (At one ounce per 10 gallons of fuel, that's 200 parts per million, or a 0.0025% concentration of acetone), the fuel system will not be harmed; ergo, any warranty will not be voided by the use of acetone in this manner. For the most part, if the plastics in your fuel system are designed to handle gasoline, then they will handle the tiny amount of acetone just fine.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 09-02-2005 05:59 AM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Acetone is a very strong solvent, and may adversely affect hoses, sealers, and gaskets. Note the disclaimer at the bottom of the linked page:

quote:
ADVISORY: With any technology, you take a high risk to invest significant time or money unless (1) independent testing has thoroughly corroborated the technology, (2) the group involved has intellectual rights to the technology, and (3) the group has the ability to make a success of the endeavor.

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Randy Stankey
Film God

Posts: 6539
From: Erie, Pennsylvania
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 09-02-2005 08:51 AM      Profile for Randy Stankey   Email Randy Stankey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
How about you give your car a complete tune up?

Air Filter. Oil Change/Filter. Plugs/Wires/Distributor Cap. Fuel Filter. Chassis/Bearing Lube. PCV/Crankcase Breather.

Make sure your tires have as much air in them as is safely allowed. (THIS ONE THING can make a noticible improvement!)

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

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From: Toronto Ontario Canada
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 - posted 09-02-2005 10:12 AM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
As fuel prices rise the availablity of ethanol fuels should increase which also has the advantage of less polution as well

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Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 09-02-2005 10:30 AM      Profile for Scott Norwood   Author's Homepage   Email Scott Norwood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I don't know the details, but my understanding from reading about this from time to time in reputable publications is that ethanol subsidies in the US are something of a scam. Apparently, the amount of energy used to produce a given amount of ethanol is actually greater than the amount of energy that is actually _in_ that amount of ethanol. The stuff mostly exists as a motor fuel because of a demand for farm subsidies and not because it actually provides any substantial economic or environmental benefit.

(Someone please correct me if I'm wrong about this.)

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Darryl Spicer
Film God

Posts: 3250
From: Lexington, KY, USA
Registered: Dec 2000


 - posted 09-02-2005 10:32 AM      Profile for Darryl Spicer     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Robert Burtcher
Uhh... Fuel additives will not void a new vehicle warranty UNLESS:

The additive causes physical damage, or
The additve adversely affects the emissions or the emissions system.
Acetone IS corrosive to many cheap plastics, but it does not harm most common metals such as steel or aluminum... If you dump a few gallons of acetone in the gas tank, then expect physical damage to the fuel injectors or other plastic parts in the fuel system. However, at the extremely low concentrations of acetone present (At one ounce per 10 gallons of fuel, that's 200 parts per million, or a 0.0025% concentration of acetone), the fuel system will not be harmed; ergo, any warranty will not be voided by the use of acetone in this manner. For the most part, if the plastics in your fuel system are designed to handle gasoline, then they will handle the tiny amount of acetone just fine.

I didn't say fuel additive could void your warrenty. Acetone is not a certified fuel additive. You have people out here that will do stupid things if not given the propper method or information about what they are putting in the tank. Put to much, cause a problem, damage occures, and warrenty gone. I believe the risks are to great to take those chances on a valuable warrenty. The costs of repairing your car because of a mistake will be greater than the amount of cost for filling the tank.

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Lyle Romer
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1400
From: Davie, FL, USA
Registered: May 2002


 - posted 09-02-2005 10:49 AM      Profile for Lyle Romer   Email Lyle Romer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Scott,

I believe you are correct. The production of "clean, pollution free ethanol" is very petroleum intensive. From the petroleum based fertilizer used to grow it to the petroleum used in the farm equipment to the energy needed to get the ethanol out of the corn.

Until somebody figures out how to convert solar energy into electricity much more efficiently or comes up with a way to use solar energy to get hydrogen out of water extrememly efficiently, the only "clean" fuel that makes any sense is Nuclear power.

Wind power chops up birds, water power can only be produced in very select places and destroys ecosystems when you dam a river. As mentioned the holy grail biofuels use fossil fuels to be produced.

True, nuclear power has the waste problem but somehow France deals with it (they produce 80 something percent of electricity with nuclear power). We should try and produce as much electricity as possible with nuclear power and then use surplus electricity to produce hydrogen fuel for vehicles. This would end our dependence on foreign countries for energy and would stop us emitting greenhouse gasses (of course whether or not CO2 emissions are really causing global warming is another debate).

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 09-02-2005 11:03 AM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Lyle, I agree with you. Unfortunately, transportation and proper disposal of spent fuel and risk of terrorist attack are very serious concerns that may not be solvable in our generation. What does France do with spent fuel?

Rochester NY is at the forefront of both hydrogen / fuel cell power, and fusion power research:

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050302/BUSINESS/503020324/1001

quote:
GM's Hy-wire fuel cell vehicle is on display at the Greater Rochester International Auto Show today through Sunday at the Riverside Convention Center.

The Hy-wire prototype has been touring the world.

But it's the first time that the vehicle has been to Rochester, even though much of the research and development that went into building the car's skateboard-like chassis was done at GM's Fuel Cell Activities Center in Honeoye Falls.


http://www.ece.uiuc.edu/seminar/98-99/fusion.html

quote:
Controlled thermonuclear fusion of hydrogen isotopes (deuterium and tritium) into helium offers the possibility of a virtually unlimited source of energy. There are primarily two experimentally different methods to cause controlled fusion of hydrogen to occur.

A magnetic field can be used to heat and confine hot hydrogen plasma for a time long enough for hydrogen atoms to fuse. Magnetic confinement "machines" such as the Tokamaks, Stellerators, and Magnetic Mirror devices fit into this category. Studies of the magnetic confinement fusion systems began in the 1940's. The current budget trend for magnetic confinement fusion research is downward and several significant programs have been terminated.

A second method of achieving controlled thermonuclear fusion uses laser or ion beams to deliver megajoules of energy in a few nanoseconds to the surface of a spherical mass of hydrogen. The hydrogen is driven radially inward at very high velocities. When the high velocity material stagnates, the temperature and density increase to extremely high values. The hydrogen can be compressed to a density of more than 20 g/cc and to temperatures of more than 100 million Kelvins. At these temperatures, the confinement time of a few nanoseconds owing to the inertial forces, is sufficient to allow the hydrogen atoms to collide often enough, and with sufficient energy, to fuse. Laser driven fusion was proposed by John Nuckolls shortly after the demonstration of a ruby laser by Ted Maiman at Hughes in the early 1960s. However, it was not until the early 1970s that well funded studies of laser driven Inertial Confinement Fusion (ICF) began. The ICF program is currently alive and well and several large projects at several laboratories are well funded. The major ICF projects in the United States are located at the Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory and Los Alamos National Laboratory (both operated by the University of California), Sandia National Laboratory Albuquerque, the Laser Laboratory for Energetics (operated by the University of Rochester, NY), and the US Naval Research Laboratory. The projects are funded by the US government through the Department of Energy


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Lyle Romer
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1400
From: Davie, FL, USA
Registered: May 2002


 - posted 09-02-2005 12:10 PM      Profile for Lyle Romer   Email Lyle Romer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: John Pytlak
What does France do with spent fuel?

That's a good question. I know there is a lot of research on a new type of reactor (I think it's called integral fast reactor or something like that) which uses the fuel more efficiently and can actually use the spent fuel we have now.

As for hydrogen, the biggest issue is how to make enough of it without using fossil fuels as the energy source.

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 09-02-2005 01:18 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Scott Norwood
Apparently, the amount of energy used to produce a given amount of ethanol is actually greater than the amount of energy that is actually _in_ that amount of ethanol.
I saw somethin on TV about this very thing. It may have even been a 60 minuited segment. You are correct that to make it takes more fuel than you end up getting.

Mark

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