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Author Topic: questions for booker/ buyers
Craig M. Spencer
Film Handler

Posts: 3
From: Elmira, NY, USA
Registered: May 2002


 - posted 03-15-2003 07:15 AM      Profile for Craig M. Spencer   Author's Homepage   Email Craig M. Spencer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I need some help, some clarification I guess ! I have been a theatre owner/operator of a single screen,722 seat theatre in Elmira Heights NY 14903(upstate/Fingerlakes region) since Jan 2003. I share the movie market in my county with a Hoyts Cinemas 10plex (Horseheads 14845), about 5 road miles from the Heights and The Elmira Drive In, 8 road miles(Big Flats) and a closed triplex in Elmira 14902. No other operating theatres within 12-15 mile.
The Heights was operated by Dipsons Theatre as a subrun until 2000 when the closed the doors.
My prices 3.00 adult and only open on weekends for now.

My questions are:
1. Can I ever change from a sub-run to a first run theatre?
If so how?
2. I have to call my booker on Monday to find out what is available for me to show on the weekend, leaving no time to promote the movie.
Is this common for subrun?
3.I would like to show Jungle Book 2, it off the screen at the Hoyts, when should this be available to me?

4. I would like to show God and Generals, Hoyts hasn't shown it yet, when will this be available to me?

I have more questions, but this is a start.
thanks in advance

Craig Spencer

www.heights-theater.com

http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/36/36015.html

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Darryl Spicer
Film God

Posts: 3250
From: Lexington, KY, USA
Registered: Dec 2000


 - posted 03-15-2003 08:52 AM      Profile for Darryl Spicer     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
When it comes to sub run Disney will wait as much as 4 months before it will make it's films availabe for sub run. You say you have to call a booker to see what is available to you on mondays. This Monday when you call, ask him the same questions you just posted here on this site. He may be able to answer those questions. Hw should be able to tell you what is going to be availabe in the future too. Film companies will give advance notice as to what is coming out in sub run in the future.

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Mark Ogden
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 943
From: Little Falls, N.J.
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 03-15-2003 10:03 AM      Profile for Mark Ogden   Email Mark Ogden   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Welcome to Film-Tech, Craig. I'm very glad that someone has reopened the Heights, a theatre that is very near and dear to me, I saw many movies there as a young man in the days when Youstie Sekella was the projectionist. I originally got my start in the business down at the now-gone Colonial and Capitol Theatres in downtown Elmira, my hometown (I grew up on Chapman Place, down off of Oakwood near the town line).

Though the Heights has been sub-run as long as I can remember (early 60s) I can't think of a single reason that you couldn't go first run, provided you have the $$ to cough for an advance. The Hoyt's at the mall is probably far enough out of town to avoid a clearence problem. The question is, can you compete technically with them? The last time I was in the Heights (a few years ago,The Green Mile was playing) the sound was still very boomy mono and the picture very dim. You did upgrade the projection and sound, right? Rule of thumb: you can get away with a lot on a $2.00 admission that you can't get away with on a $7.50 admission. Just being a shorter drive won't cut it anymore, if the presentation quality isn't there.

Best wishes for the future. I get back to see family now and then, I will drop by and see how you are doing.

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 03-15-2003 11:57 AM      Profile for Mike Blakesley   Author's Homepage   Email Mike Blakesley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Craig - You can always promote your upcoming films. Just look at the top ten list....those are the movies you'll likely be playing, providing you play mostly mainstream film. Get one-sheets and traiers accordingly. Snipe your one-sheets with things like "Coming Soon" or "Coming next month." After a while you'll usually know what's coming when, within a week or two. Your booker (if he's any good) can often estimate what's coming for the next few weeks.

The only thing you can't do is promote the exact play date, but that's what you have newspaper ads for.

If you find you won't be playing something after all, you can always take your posters down. I would much rather pay the postage and/or cost for a poster and trailer for something we don't wind up playing, rather than find out the movie's coming and have no promo material at all.

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Bill Carter
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 162
From: Minneapolis, Minnesota
Registered: Sep 1999


 - posted 03-15-2003 12:06 PM      Profile for Bill Carter   Email Bill Carter   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Even though the studios can and do freely change up the date a picture hits sub-run, your booker should be able to tell you what is "probably" coming up for the next several weeks. It may be as simple as just asking him. If he won't even try to help you plan a little farther out than four days, try to find another booker.

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Jack Ondracek
Film God

Posts: 2348
From: Port Orchard, WA, USA
Registered: Oct 2002


 - posted 03-15-2003 12:12 PM      Profile for Jack Ondracek   Author's Homepage   Email Jack Ondracek   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello, Craig.
Welcome to Film-Tech!
We've been through this situation, both at our drive-in (a 17-year adventure) and at our more recently acquired quad indoor.

Everything, from how aggressively your booker promotes his clients (you) to the relationship you (and your competition) have with the studios can have an effect on the films you get (and when).

Probably your biggest challenge is your physical plant itself, and the economics of the business. It's pretty hard to make a go of a large, single screen building when the studios are taking a 60-70% bite of your opening week and demanding 2-4 week minimum bookings. If you're in a "2-week town", your audience is pretty much gone by the time the percentages drop to where you can make a buck. Meanwhile, other films are passing you by and you have no screens to put them. After your initial crowd drops (40+ % after the first week), you're heating/cooling a pretty big room for the crowd you'll likely get.

Your $3 admission will likely not pass muster with the studios. Most of them have clauses in their master licenses which will require that you get your (evening) prices up closer to competitive levels (unless you want to pay the difference out of concession income).
They also will be less-than-impressed with a 3-day week... especially if you go head to head with the other theater over a particular title.

Your competition will have obvious reasons to object to your proposed change, and may request (or already have) a "clearance" in your market. This basically means that if they're running a print as little as one time per day, you won't get it. Clearances border, if not outright smack of antitrust / anticompetitive trade practices, though many states are reluctant to take one man's problem to court against a large chain and Hollywood's studios. Breaking a clearance is largely a political excercise, requiring a good booker (or great connections on your part), good relations with the studios, lots of patience (figure at least a year) and convincing reasoning on your part why a booking in your theatre would be a good business move on the part of the studios as opposed to booking the film at currently established venues. Each studio you deal with will have to make the decision to serve you individually, though the process does become easier once you've managed to get one or two online with you.

Monday bookings are common for sub-run operations because it's on this day that your booker usually finds out what's dropping into that category or what the other guys might choose to hold over. It's one of those unfortunate side-effects of how the industry has progressed over the years, and makes it pretty difficult to set up any kind of long-term promotions. About the only way around this is to run films even older than you're getting now... and of course, the down side to that is the shortened window before these films go into video.

All that being said, let's assume you're willing to run an operation similar to your 10-screen competition... 3 to 5 shows a day, 7 days a week. You'll need to have your booker notify the studios that you want into the first-run market. At best, this will mean that you'll be on some form of allocation with the 10-plexer. A crude description of this process goes somewhat along the lines of... studio comes out with 11 films this year. You'll get one, and the other guy will get 10. Chances are... you won't get the best one, either... that's until you find a way to get impressive attendance (read: "grosses") with the film you do get. Depending on the laws of your state & other competitive factors, you may have to bid terms to get better titles.

All in all, it's a bit challenging. It can be done, but it takes time for the studios to make the transition to thinking of you as a first-run theatre. It's also very far from a sure bet, and probably not something you'll be able to do without substantial outside income for awhile. At best, you're going to do a major turnover in your audience. Your $3 customers won't be happy with a price increase, even if it means newer films. They're attending your business now because of the balance you're offering. When you change that, you're presenting something that will take a while for your area to get used to.

If you do give this a try, please keep us up to date on your progress. It's not something that's successfully done very often (it usually goes the other way).

Good luck! [thumbsup]

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Aaron Sisemore
Flaming Ribs beat Reeses Peanut Butter Cups any day!

Posts: 3061
From: Rockwall TX USA
Registered: Sep 1999


 - posted 03-15-2003 03:53 PM      Profile for Aaron Sisemore   Email Aaron Sisemore   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Another caveat with going first-run is you may get stuck running (either because the studios say that this is the film you will get, or a film you chose to run) major 'bomb' pictures that you will be stuck showing for 3-4 weeks at a time.

I speak from experience, a theatre (950 seat single) I worked at went from 'dollar house' to first run in 1989-90 and got screwed with such cinematic gems as 'Young Einstein' and 'Family Business' for 4 weeks a pop...We made more revenue as a dollar house [Eek!]

-Aaron

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Steve Kraus
Film God

Posts: 4094
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Registered: May 2000


 - posted 03-15-2003 05:15 PM      Profile for Steve Kraus     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Now there's a racket I could really get into. X dollars a week per screen to book pretty much the same stuff into a large multiplex as every other plex is playing at what is probably pretty much the same deal. Just would have to sign up enough clients to have the necessary pull with the studios.

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Jack Ondracek
Film God

Posts: 2348
From: Port Orchard, WA, USA
Registered: Oct 2002


 - posted 03-15-2003 06:49 PM      Profile for Jack Ondracek   Author's Homepage   Email Jack Ondracek   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
from Aaron S.:
I worked at went ... to first run... and got screwed with such cinematic gems as 'Young Einstein' and 'Family Business' for 4 weeks a pop

Ahhhh.... you missed those cinematic BOMBshells, Million Dollar Mystery, the 90 minute Glad Bag commercial from Dino DeLaurentiis, and Who's That Girl, one of Madonna's MUSICAL(?) epics which was provided in MONO sound and for which the studio was demanding (and getting) guarantees (probably smart for the studio!) [Mad]

quote:
from Steve:
Now there's a racket I could really get into. X dollars a week per screen to book...

Some of them work for a flat fee + percentage overage... it covers their butt if the picture bombs, but lets them skim off the top ... ummmm..sorry.... SHARE the benefits their talents bring to your business!

Actually, some of them are pretty good... but if you're new to the biz or don't keep an eye on that part of it a bad one can kill your operation before you realize your head and tail have inverted their normal positions.

Give it a try, Steve! It'll keep the fires burning between screenings! [Big Grin]

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Darryl Spicer
Film God

Posts: 3250
From: Lexington, KY, USA
Registered: Dec 2000


 - posted 03-15-2003 07:24 PM      Profile for Darryl Spicer     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Ahhhh.... you missed those cinematic BOMBshells, Million Dollar Mystery, the 90 minute Glad Bag commercial from Dino DeLaurentiis.
That's the film that stuntman Dar Robinson was supposedly working on when he was killed doing a motor cycle stunt.

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Richard C. Wolfe
Master Film Handler

Posts: 250
From: Northampton, PA, USA
Registered: Apr 2000


 - posted 03-17-2003 11:10 PM      Profile for Richard C. Wolfe   Author's Homepage   Email Richard C. Wolfe   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Craig:

Welcome to the world of independent exhibition. As the owner of a single screen subrun for the past 33 years, allow me to give my perspective on your questions.

1. I'm sure you could change to firstrun, but why do you want to? Others have already listed most of the disadvantages of being a first run with only one screen. I'm one who truly believes that subrun can still work. It's not as easy as it once was, and will take a lot of work to develope your audience, but it can be done. For the most part, a subrun will play to an entirely different audience then a first run. But they will be a very loyal audience once established. That audience will consist of for the most part the so-called "lost audience" that the industry doesn't get or try to get for the most part... the over 40 segment of the population. You can also develope the young family audience, that is the families with young kids that can't afford to go to a first run megaplex on a regular basis. I'm not talking about a discount house as discount IS dead. A $3.00 admission is not a discount. That is what I charge as a subrun, and I have no problem getting product as soon as it comes off of first run, and in some cases even before it has come off first run. As a subrun you will probably have no competition for the audience that you develope. They was a time many years ago when I first started in this business that I thought that there was great prestige to be first run. Now I know that I would much rather be 1st class then first run. There are some in the business, even some that post here, that think 2nd run means 2nd class. Sure, there are some crappy 2nd run houses around, but a lot of crappy first run ones as well. The theatre will be whatever you make it. You can have a 1st class 2nd run, and if you do, it will make an even bigger impression then the first run would. What you won't get as a subrun is the 13 to 30 age patrons as they will run off to the megaplex the first week a new picture opens. Believe me, your theatre is better off without them. Face the facts... if you were 1st run, you still wouldn't get the 13 to 30 year olds. They are megaplex oriented... it's a social thing for that group, and they won't change.

2.Booking on Monday for Friday is the norm in the subrun business. However, I refuse to do it. There is no reason why you must do that. Sure, your booker finds out on Monday what has just come off or has been made available for Friday, but why do you have to book it right away? Wait one week so you have a week to run the trailer, and have the posters up so your current patrons can see what it is you have coming next. Also as someone else has already said, put up posters of the product you feel that you will be playing with COMING or COMING SOON dater cards on them. If you have no other subrun competition near you, what does it matter that you wait another week to play a picture. I happen to be in a market where there is another 2nd run who always books on Monday for Friday to get the newest available hot picture. He therefore for the most part almost always plays ahead of me. I usually come in after him or during his 2nd week, but always gross twice as much as he does. So it doesn't seem to matter if you don't play on that first Friday after the Monday avail. If you keep your patrons informed, have a nice theatre, and a good presentation, they will wait for you to get it.

3. Jungle Book 2 should be available to you if the first runs are off of it as you are not a discount house.

4.As for Gods and Generals, Warners has a national subrun policy for the most part. Therefore, you will have to wait until they make it available subrun for the entire country.

If you go after the first run market, how will your theatre compare to the other first run megaplexes? You will have to charge the $7.00 or $8.00 admission as they do, but will you have stadium seating, digital sound, cupholders, acres of free parking etc. etc. Why would a moviegoer select your theatre over the new plexes? Only you can answer that question, as I don't know your theatre. As a subrun, you'll have a different audience that will patronize you for a number of reasons totally different from what the usual first run patron expects.

First run doesn't mean success. Booking good product into a clean, comfortable, well run theatre with a flare of showmanship, regardless of the run can bring success.

I have made a comfortable living all my life from my single screen subrun theatre, and I think others can still do it as well if you're willing to put forth the effort to see it through.

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