Film-Tech Cinema Systems
Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE


  
my profile | my password | search | faq & rules | forum home
  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Ground Level   » AP: Theaters to warn on movie piracy (Page 1)

 
This topic comprises 3 pages: 1  2  3 
 
Author Topic: AP: Theaters to warn on movie piracy
William Hooper
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1879
From: Mobile, AL USA
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 08-21-2002 05:09 AM      Profile for William Hooper   Author's Homepage   Email William Hooper   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
"A leading theater chain has agreed to run before movies public service announcements that warn against copyright infringement"

"Chernin would not name the theater chain involved."

Story:
Click right around in here


 |  IP: Logged

Robert E. Allen
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1078
From: Checotah, Oklahoma
Registered: Jul 2002


 - posted 08-21-2002 01:21 PM      Profile for Robert E. Allen   Email Robert E. Allen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Sadly William, that won't deter piracy. People who do this are aware of the law. What we need are laws that will allow us more access to what the pirates are doing and then some convictions with the maximum penalty.

Bob
The Old Showman

 |  IP: Logged

Jesse Skeen
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1517
From: Sacramento, CA
Registered: Aug 2000


 - posted 08-21-2002 01:46 PM      Profile for Jesse Skeen   Email Jesse Skeen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Can someone make me a copy of that warning?

 |  IP: Logged

Thomas Procyk
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1842
From: Royal Palm Beach, FL, USA
Registered: Feb 2002


 - posted 08-22-2002 12:57 PM      Profile for Thomas Procyk   Email Thomas Procyk   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I was thinking along those same lines, Jesse. If that snipe that they're going to play before movies is as cheesy as the "No Pirates" sign (discussed in another thread), then those who bootleg the films will more than likely bootleg that snipe to attach to the warez they peddle.

Snipes, Slides, and Posters hoping to deter movie piracy are probably as effective, if not less, than those same materials which attempt to deter cell phone use in auditoriums. Now that, they should start arresting people for.

=TMP=

 |  IP: Logged

Claude S. Ayakawa
Film God

Posts: 2738
From: Waipahu, Hawaii, USA
Registered: Aug 2002


 - posted 08-22-2002 01:45 PM      Profile for Claude S. Ayakawa   Author's Homepage   Email Claude S. Ayakawa   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The Piracy warning will have the same effect as the 'Turn Off Cel Phones & Pagers' and "NO Talking During The Movie" trailers. It will be ignored by people who are doing it.

-Claude


 |  IP: Logged

Jesse Skeen
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1517
From: Sacramento, CA
Registered: Aug 2000


 - posted 08-22-2002 05:19 PM      Profile for Jesse Skeen   Email Jesse Skeen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Ever see the sketch-comedy film "Amazon Women on the Moon"? There's a hilarious segment called Video Pirates where they pop a tape in and the FBI warning comes up and one of them says "Ohh, I'm soooo scared!" followed by maniacal laughter.

 |  IP: Logged

Frank Angel
Film God

Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 08-22-2002 05:46 PM      Profile for Frank Angel   Author's Homepage   Email Frank Angel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
How much money do you think I can make if I invent and market a device that will JAM cell phones and pagers? My market: theatres (mine gets the prototype), restaurants, school classrooms, car manufactures, etc. Surely this couldn't be that difficult a circuit to design and produce -- there has been jamming transmission in use since W.W.I. I say this partly tongue-in-cheek, but I bet it sure would be a big seller to certain industries.

As for some anti-piracy trailer (whose publicity stunt was this anyway, Jack Vallenti's?) being stuck up on the screen before each feature starts, personally it's a rotten idea; I will not put up the studio's copyright infringment warning signs all over my theatre. I respect my patrons and this is not the Gestapo atmosphere I want to engender when people walk into the theatre or settle down to see a movie.

I think the distributor can ask that I take reasonable precautions to prevent his property from being copied while in my possession, but I get to say how I do that -- it's my theatre and I'll take those precautions as I see fit. Putting an usher in the theatre while the show is running is something I do anyway and that usher can easily spot a video pirate aiming a camera at the screen; it's exponentially more effective than any sign, slide, or mood-breaking trailer on the screen.

Does the distributor want to BUY time on my screen or rent 1 sheet space in my lobby or on my time on the preview monitors in the lobby to push whatever message tickles his fancy at the moment? Ahhh.....it's not THAT important to him, is it?! Let him do what is necessary to protect his property at his own expense.

Look, any industry expert and even anyone even peripherally involved with the piracy issue knows that the guy in the theatre videotaping from a screen is making a copy that is simply not any threat to the industry. If it were, the studios would be actively going after that source, but they haven't and aren't.

Every print has anti-piracy codes that cannot be removed from the videocopies and can easily be traced to any theatre that played any particular print. This security system is very effective and has been in place for years. It's never been followed up with respect to the off-the-screen camera copies because the copies are total crap usless except to street corner vendors. No follow-up because this is not an economic threat. Has anyone from either the FBI or the MPAA or any studio representative EVER come to your theatre with code evidence that a copy was made from one of your screens? Surely if these orgs were focusing on such this in-theatre source of copyrighted tapes, SOME theatre managers would certainly be hearing about it.

It is the video transfer from audition copies that are give out to the Academy members that is the biggest "leak" source that winds up as pristine DVD copies all over the world. Funny, you don't hear the MPAA ranting about Academy members being potential copyright infringers, do you? Putting nonsense, threatening trailers on the screen will have about as much impact on real, sophisticated infringement sources as putting those FBI warnings all over film cans and VHS boxes. It's a joke that the MPAA uses to convince the studios to keep paying dues and to keep money flowing to supporting it and keep JV in a job.

Frank


 |  IP: Logged

Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 08-22-2002 05:56 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Well, actually there needs to be safeguards put into movie prints. But the biggest source of piracy I see in films today are DVD screener discs. This is where all those $10 Chinese dubbed DVDs from films still in theaters are appearing. Why bother lifting a 35mm release print and doing a telecine master of it when one can just crack the copy protection algorithm and make millions of DVD dubs?

People mainly want to buy bootleg DVDs and tapes of a movie while it is still in theatrical release. Who cares about it after the regular DVD is available?

 |  IP: Logged

William Hooper
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1879
From: Mobile, AL USA
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 08-23-2002 12:50 AM      Profile for William Hooper   Author's Homepage   Email William Hooper   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
How much money do you think I can make if I invent and market a device that will JAM cell phones and pagers?

They've been chasing this even longer in legit theaters. The bottom line is that it's illegal in the US to construct a device to jam radio receivers even in your own building. I believe I read that it is done in some other country, maybe Japan.

Otherwise, I would construct a device that would let their phone ring in the theater, but when they stuck it to their ear & said hello the phone would emit a piercing feedback screech. Let everyone in the auditorium get a good laugh! I like audiences! They come to your house & they like to have a good time!



 |  IP: Logged

Leo Enticknap
Film God

Posts: 7474
From: Loma Linda, CA
Registered: Jul 2000


 - posted 08-28-2002 02:47 AM      Profile for Leo Enticknap   Author's Homepage   Email Leo Enticknap   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
This might seem off-topic, but I've got another example which proves that just asking people to behave with consideration to others isn't enough; you've got to make them.

On long-distance trains in this country, all but one or two carriages have a 'no smoking' rule. Smoking is not allowed, and the law allows the train companies to impose large fines on anyone caught doing so. For that reason, no-one ever smokes in these carriages. Some train companies also have a 'quiet carriage'. It is intended for people who need to work during the journey (which almost always means me), or who just want some peace. These carriages have notices in the windows requesting that people refrain from using mobile 'phones and walkmans, talking in a raised voice or anything else which could make a significant noise.

Like the speed limits on Britain's roads, this request is almost universally ignored. I have often asked people to switch off mobiles in these carriages and have usually received abuse in return. On one occasion I asked the guard if he could persuade some teenage yobbo to behave herself, only to be told that he has no way of legally doing so. He is able to fine someone smoking in the no smoking carriage, but has no legal sanction against someone using a mobile in the no mobiles carriage. This reasoning is exactly the same as with speed limits - someone driving at 40 in a 30 limit knows that (i) they stand a 99% chance of getting away with it, and (ii) even if they don't, the fine they will receive is insignificant compared to the cost of running a car.

The same applies to mobile 'phones and piracy using camcorders in cinemas. Like those stickers in the windows of no mobiles carriages, snipes asking cinemagoers not to pirate films aren't worth the polyester they're printed on unless they're backed up by the knowledge that something very unpleasant will happen to anyone who ignores them. The kind of unpleasantness I have in mind consists, first of all, of a 10kW follow-spot in the booth behind each auditorium. If anyone is seen using either a mobile 'phone or a camcorder, I would stop the film, shine it directly on him or her, then get three Schwarzenegger-like male ushers to forcibly remove him or her from the cinema. If the miscreant was attempting piracy, (s)he would then be handed directly over to the Police. When word gets out that this will happen to you if you break the law, then the problem will soon go elsewhere.


 |  IP: Logged

John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 08-28-2002 07:34 AM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Film piracy IS a crime. Theatres finding anyone copying a film can have the person arrested:
http://www.mpaa.org/anti-piracy/
http://www.fbi.gov/hq/cid/fc/fifu/about/about_ipc.htm
http://www.fbi.gov/congress/congress01/kubic061201.htm
http://www.cybercrime.gov/spatafore.htm
http://news.zdnet.co.uk/story/0,,t283-s2111155,00.html
http://www.newsfactor.com/perl/story/18041.html

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: +1 585 477 5325 Cell: +1 585 781 4036 Fax: +1 585 722 7243
e-mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion

 |  IP: Logged

Frank Angel
Film God

Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 08-29-2002 09:38 PM      Profile for Frank Angel   Author's Homepage   Email Frank Angel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Yes, there are all sorts of legal potholes one can get caught up in, many of which would seem do go counter to common sense. For example, we sell a reserved seat house for a live concert. A patron with the wrong ticket plunks himself down in someone else's seat. An usher comes by with a patron who has the correct ticket for that seat which is now occupied. Off hand, you would think that the theatre management has the right to evict that seat crasher.....yes? but how? Do you physically pull him out of the seat? Yes, if you want a major lawsuit on your hands. It varies from state to state, but in most states you don't have a right to physically remove him -- in fact, in most places, lawyers would advise you that the rule of thumb is, NEVER touch a patron. As illogical as it sounds, the safest course of action is to warn him and then back off. You can try to persuade him to leave the seat, but if he is incalctrant and simply sits there, you have only one real choice and that is to call the police. Any idea how important the police in a metropolitan area regard a ticket/seating dispute? You will be lucky if they arrive a few hours after the show is over. So you are stuck with a few solutions, most of which are as unpleasant than the next. You can try to get him to vacate the seat -- that usually will include arguing and raised voices; if the show starts, you now are disturbing other paying customers and still upsetting the people who have the legitimate tickets. As unfair as it seems to the theatre management, what you do is leave the guy in the seat and try to seat the people who are seatless in better house seats (that's why you ALWAYS hold good house seats, as much as that can be very painful with good selling shows). You call the cops on the seat-crasher but you have to time it so that the cops hopefully can remove him at an intermission. If they come during the show, you don't really want five or six of them barging down the isle with their flashlights going every which way and yelling at the guy -- "Police -- stand and back away from the seat" while they drag the guy out of the seat and into the isle, all the while he's kicking and screaming "Police brutality" while, say, Yo-Yo Ma is playing a quiet cello solo on stage.

It really is a major problem and it takes real management skill to assess the situation and find the best way to deal with it. Many times the macho, get-tuff, no nonsense buldozer approach may not be the smartest thing to do -- you might win the battle but loose the war, given the greater potential damage you can cause.

In the case of the guy videotaping the film. You call the police. They don't arrive instantaniously -- if he tries to leave the theatre, do you try to restrain him? Do you put your staff in harms way to protect an MPAA member studio from looseing money on some potential ticket sales (their 90% -- your 10%)?

All I am saying is that it's not as cut and dry as it may seem at first.

 |  IP: Logged

Thomas Procyk
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1842
From: Royal Palm Beach, FL, USA
Registered: Feb 2002


 - posted 08-29-2002 11:28 PM      Profile for Thomas Procyk   Email Thomas Procyk   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I never click banner ads, but this piece of software caught my eye:
http://www.dvdsqueeze.com/yahoo2.htm

It's a program that copies and compresses an entire DVD onto a single CD without loss of quality. The ad banner was flashing, "Copy ANY DVD to a single CD!! Download Now!!" Now they can scream and shout that it's not the intended use of the software, but it sounds like it makes it extremely easy to "Copy any DVD" and put it up for people to "Download Now"...

=TMP=

 |  IP: Logged

Frank Angel
Film God

Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 08-31-2002 11:20 AM      Profile for Frank Angel   Author's Homepage   Email Frank Angel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Come on....how do you get DVD quality from a CD-R? They are totally different animals. So this copied CD then is played how? in a DVD player and the DVD player plays it as if it were a DVD? Unless I am missing something, that's just impossible. Sounds more like a scam to get you to the site.

Also, beware of these banner hawkers that present intriguing come-ons. Especially if to order the product you wind up giving credit card information, or even just being asked to "register" with them. In the registration process they ask you to pick a password. Do you know that 9 out of 10 people use the SAME password for EVERYTHING? Once you register and pick a password, the unscrupulous internet thief can simply go to your ISP, say AOL and with any luck, he can access your entire account because he's got your password. Many times he can then get into your back accounts, other sites that let him order goods and services. It might not work all the time for the thief, but it only has to work once with you to hurt. It is a major problem for unsuspecting consumers.

Frank

 |  IP: Logged

Thomas Procyk
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1842
From: Royal Palm Beach, FL, USA
Registered: Feb 2002


 - posted 08-31-2002 12:05 PM      Profile for Thomas Procyk   Email Thomas Procyk   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I'm thinking that the compressed DVD on the CD-R would play much like a VCD, in that you can watch it on your computer or in a VCD compatible DVD player. That's the only way I can think of that they could accomplish what they're talking about. But still, you won't (can't?) get DVD quality. Then again, most people who would probably be interested in copying DVDs don't care about the loss of quality, because if they did, they would buy the original.

=TMP=

 |  IP: Logged



All times are Central (GMT -6:00)
This topic comprises 3 pages: 1  2  3 
 
   Close Topic    Move Topic    Delete Topic    next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:



Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classicTM 6.3.1.2

The Film-Tech Forums are designed for various members related to the cinema industry to express their opinions, viewpoints and testimonials on various products, services and events based upon speculation, personal knowledge and factual information through use, therefore all views represented here allow no liability upon the publishers of this web site and the owners of said views assume no liability for any ill will resulting from these postings. The posts made here are for educational as well as entertainment purposes and as such anyone viewing this portion of the website must accept these views as statements of the author of that opinion and agrees to release the authors from any and all liability.

© 1999-2020 Film-Tech Cinema Systems, LLC. All rights reserved.