Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Paying .5% of gross to Music rights assoc.

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Topic: Paying .5% of gross to Music rights assoc.

Kevin Baglow
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 135
From: Yeppoon Qld, Australia
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 05-29-2002 07:59 AM

In australia APRA (Australian Performing Rights Assoc.) asks for a % of box office for the music used in films. What other countrys have to pay that? On top of the usual 50+% to distributors. I thought music rights were paid for by the Film company.

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Paul G. Thompson
The Weenie Man

Posts: 4718
From: Mount Vernon WA USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 05-29-2002 09:37 AM

That is the first time I ever heard that one happening......

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Joe Beres
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 606
From: Minneapolis, MN, USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 05-29-2002 09:46 AM

I could maybe understand them wanting some money for music played in the theater before and after any films, but I can't imagine the theater having to pay for music used in the films. In the US, technically, royalties should be paid for music played in a theaterbefore and after the show, but I would guess that very few theaters actually pay them. I would assume that theaters using any sort of music subscription service, movietunes for example, have those fees built into the subscription.

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David Favel
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 764
From: Ashburton, New Zealand
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 05-29-2002 10:25 PM

Yea, they sent me a letter saying the exact same thing.

Apparently films pay for/ask permission to use music.
This is their way of getting paid.

It all seems a bit suspect to me, however Hoyts pay them so I don't see how a wee guy like myself can stand up to them.

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Kevin Baglow
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 135
From: Yeppoon Qld, Australia
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 05-29-2002 10:55 PM

It seams like they have ony bothered to approach a few of the indies. we must be the Unlucky ones

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Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99

posted 05-29-2002 11:38 PM

Thankfully, we don't have to deal with this in the US. The film producer has already (presumably) paid for the music rights for the movie and this includes the rights for the theatres to show the films and reproduce the music in them (as I understand things).

The only reason why a US theatre would want to purchase an ASCAP license would be if they wanted to play ASCAP-labelled non-sync music. Someone who has gone through the process will probably comment here, but I believe that they have flat-rate fees based on the size of the theatre.

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Jerry Chase
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1068
From: Margate, FL, USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 05-29-2002 11:49 PM

Kevin, I smell a scam. Contact an attorney and get an opinion. If it is true, it might be time to lobby your government to outlaw the practice. It amounts to "double dipping" and a violation of the contract you sign for film rental.

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Brad Haven
Master Film Handler

Posts: 300
From: fremantle, West Australia
Registered: Aug 2001

posted 05-30-2002 10:24 AM

We pay APRA a yearly fee, which allows us to play any music on the premises, i forget how much?.
Kevin , do you pay that as well OR was this just so you can play each films soundtrack?.
I have not heard of this one before??.
If one cinema is being made to pay this, then all cinemas should!

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Paul Cassidy
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 549
From: Auckland, New Zealand
Registered: Aug 2001

posted 05-30-2002 12:27 PM

Yes they used to bother me with this and they had been trying the same with any public performance of music , in Take Away Food Stores even back ground music in Malls etc.maybe even Buskers

------------------
A KIWI eats,roots & Leaves.

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Kevin Baglow
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 135
From: Yeppoon Qld, Australia
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 05-30-2002 04:53 PM

There are two groups
APRA, And the other one: PPCA who charges for all background music royaltys for any business

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99

posted 05-31-2002 11:28 AM

Suposedly that is one purpose of the otherwise-useless MovieTunes...you can play those disks without incurring any royalty. So if you are getting hassled to get an ASCAP or BMI license, play Movietunes (until the heat's off, of course!

)

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Dick Vaughan
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1032
From: Bradford, West Yorkshire, UK
Registered: Jul 2000

posted 06-05-2002 03:39 AM

PRS, The Performing Rights Society, in the UK charge us an annual fee for the use of copyright music in the theatres and throughout the rest of the museum.

they also charge hairdressers ,shops, factories etc a fee for playing the radio in their salons,also copyright music "on hold" .

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Dustin Mitchell
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1865
From: Mondovi, WI, USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 06-05-2002 03:21 PM

I'm a tad confused by the original post. Are you paying for the music that is part of the movie soundtrack, ie the stuff that is read off the film or the DTS discs and played with the movie, or are you paying for lobby and intermission music? If it is the later, yeah, at least by US law you've gotta pay. If it is the former-either you're being 'shaked down' or Australian copyright law is insanely screwed up. If the music is part of a movies sound you shouldn't have to pay a dime. The film company has presumably already payed this. Your booking contract gives you the right to play the movie-that includes picture and sound-in exchange for the fee you pay the distributor.

It sounds to me like the APRA is 'double dipping' as one poster put it.

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Kevin Baglow
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 135
From: Yeppoon Qld, Australia
Registered: Dec 2000

posted 06-07-2002 04:59 AM

APRA wants a % of box office for the music used in the films that (I pay the distributors for). APRA say they will send a list of films that they don't represent the music rights for. They have never sent me a list though.
As written in a previous comment--Hoyts & (GREATER UNION) say that they pay APRA (AUSTRALIAN PERFORMING RIGHTS ASSOC.)so where do small indies stand?

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Dustin Mitchell
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1865
From: Mondovi, WI, USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 06-08-2002 01:27 AM

Like I said before I have no idea how Australian copyright law works so I might be completely off here but that sounds like a load of BS (from the ARPA, not you). It makes absolutely no sense. Unless another Aussie contradicts (somehow I think this is likely) I'd recomend you contact a lawyer who specializes in copyright law and ask them for their advice.

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