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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Ground Level   » Refunds or Passes for controversial content in movies (Page 1)

 
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Author Topic: Refunds or Passes for controversial content in movies
Joshua Voorhies
Film Handler

Posts: 45
From: Overland Park, KS
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 08-08-2001 02:45 AM      Profile for Joshua Voorhies   Author's Homepage   Email Joshua Voorhies   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I was wondering what opinions the managers out there had of giving refunds or passes to people upset with something controversial in the movie.

I bring this up because I had a guy come up to me, well after close, wanting a refund on Original Sin. He explained he had watched the whole movie with his girl friend, but he was upset at the scene where a guy kissed Antonio Banderas. Just for the record, Banderas shot the guy after getting kissed. He shot him several times. He shot him good.
Even though the film didn't condone homosexuality in any way, the guy felt it did, and was adament about the money he paid on tickets not going to the studio (later in the conversation I realized he was quite the Baptist Bible Thumper).
As it was 1am, I couldn't get him a refund at the time and he couldn't come back the next day. I wound up giving him passes and telling him I would refund his tix for Original Sin and ring up a more wholesome movie (I lied). I felt bad after doing that for two reasons: 1) the movie ran fine. He was upset with the content. It had an R rating, he should have been prepared for it. He didn't deserve any freebies. 2) I doubt he found the whole movie unentertaining. The movie makers deserved that money.

Some other cases:
-the old lady who demanded a refund because the Fast and the Furious had a 1/2 sec shot of two girls kissing. Lesbians offended her. I gave her a refund and that's it; it was only about 40min into the movie.
-the guy who bitched about the offensiveness of Me, Myself, and Irene. The manager on duty gave him about 4 passes and a refund.

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Christopher Duvall
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 500
From: Denver, CO
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 08-08-2001 03:33 AM      Profile for Christopher Duvall   Email Christopher Duvall   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Giving refunds and passes to those customers only re-enforced that behavior in the future. I strongly believe that customers should research the movie before watching. In the past, if a customer had a problem with the content of a movie, I would redirect them to the studio that distributed the movie. It is not the fault of the theatres of what is portrayed in a movie. Now, I will empathize with the customer and I am very cordial with them. I will give them addresses to websites that give reasons for ratings and addresses of the studios so they can contact them. One place I started checking out is ScreenIt.com
http://www.screenit.com/

They break down every possible "offensive" clips of all movies released. The MPAA is another great source for that as well.
http://www.mpaa.org/

As far as a movie just plain sucking...tough. That is what movie reviewers and critics are for. Again, customers really need to do some research before walking up to the box office. Hollywood may eventually smarten up and stop making rotten movies if the customers would not go to movies they read about truly sucking. Do you think Warner would have let Joel Schlockmaker to make a 4th Batman film if the customers realized what a piece of crap the 3rd one was and did not show up for it?

In short, customers need to take their beefs with movies to the companies making the films and not the theatre managers. As theatre managers, we are responsible for running a perfect presentation, making and selling tasty snacks and keep the environment clean and safe. It is not to have the customers walk over us because they did not like seeing two dudes kiss in a movie.
I will now step down from the soapbox...


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Jim Ziegler
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 753
From: West Hollywood, CA
Registered: Jul 99


 - posted 08-08-2001 05:03 AM      Profile for Jim Ziegler   Email Jim Ziegler   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thats not as bad as the woman who cam eup to me one day, told me she fell asleep in a movie, and "wanted to know what I was going to do about it."

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Michael Brown
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1522
From: Bradford, England
Registered: May 2001


 - posted 08-08-2001 06:51 AM      Profile for Michael Brown   Email Michael Brown   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Cinemas should definately not give refunds for movie content. If the film was projected with a good quality picture and good sound then patron should have to pay. I saw tombraider (which i hated) but i would not ask for a refund because its was presented with no problems.

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Bob Maar
(Maar stands for Maartini)


Posts: 28608
From: New York City & Newport, RI
Registered: Feb 2001


 - posted 08-08-2001 07:04 AM      Profile for Bob Maar   Author's Homepage   Email Bob Maar   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Anybody out here , who is willing to give a refund or a pass for film content...Please let me know. I will notify my friends in your area to patronize your theatre.

P.S. If your in the New York area, I will visit personally.

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Steven Pickles
Film Handler

Posts: 81
From: Gainesville, FL, USA
Registered: Mar 2001


 - posted 08-08-2001 08:43 AM      Profile for Steven Pickles   Email Steven Pickles   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
So long as my commitment to the customer has been fulfilled, I will not give refunds or passes. I have to evaluate each situation a little bit differently because I hate people walking out unhappy or upset that they ever came to the theatre in the first place. If I find that some bases we should have had covered were overlooked then I will make them happy... if they are being bitchy I will usually refund so as to not directly invite the problem back into the door, while passes I usually use to regain faith in the company. I don't want to bring a trouble patron--or one who picks us apart--back if I don't have to... because in any theatre you can find something that isn't up to par all the time. Well I'm getting off-subject so I'll stop here.

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Jerry Chase
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1068
From: Margate, FL, USA
Registered: Nov 2000


 - posted 08-08-2001 01:52 PM      Profile for Jerry Chase   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I disagree with all of you. Strongly.

In this case, I agree with the concept that the "Baptist Bible Thumper" was trying to get across.

It is NOT up to the moviegoer to do anything more than a cursory check of reviews. This is entertainment guys, and telling a potential customer that they have to research a film before seeing it is shooting yourself in the foot with a double barreled shotgun. Do you see restaurants objecting when a customer takes a few bites of a dish and then refuses to eat it? Sheesh.

People who object to a film strongly enough to walk out want to be heard. In most cases, the money isn't the issue.

When managing, I gave a pass if the person could present a straightforward statement of why an aspect of the film affected them so strongly that they felt they had to walk out -whether or not I agreed with those views. If the person wanted a refund, I made sure they showed me their I.D. and filled out a refund voucher with their name. Sometimes, I even provided the customer with the written name and address of the distributor, to impress upon the person the idea of complaining where it might make a difference (and also, to fix in the customer's mind that the process of getting a refund wasn't terribly easy and each of us would likely remember the other person on sight.)

All of the above holds provided the customer walked out mid-show. Anyone who stayed to the end never got a refund, and only rarely got a pass.

It is not a theatre manager's responsibility to honor ever piece of s--- film that comes out other than to present it properly and professionally. It IS the manager's responsibility to honor the bond with the customer. The production company that releases a crappy film may not even be around until next season, and the people there could give a rodent's derrier about anything but the fast buck. The customer, OTOH, will -if treated properly- come back many times.

I know about "problem" customers, and those that leave mid-show because they are offended, are usually not "problem" customers, but are customers who give a damn about what they see and who they support. Frankly, if we had more of them, there would be more 70mm films like "Lawrence of Arabia" and fewer slice-and-dice or bathroom humor films. When the last one gives up and leaves without a fight, we might as well ask him to turn out the marquee as he goes, because without feedback and financial responsibility there won't be anything worth watching.

I sympathize that dealing with this type of complaint is anything but fun, but the general blame for it lies outside of your direct control. It is in your best interest to teach customers how to complain effectively, even if you can't teach tolerance. You don't need to be whipping boys when the solution for both you and the complaining customer is on the label of a film can or at the bottom of a poster.


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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 08-08-2001 02:05 PM      Profile for Mike Blakesley   Author's Homepage   Email Mike Blakesley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Sometimes when people have complained about the movie content, I have apologized for it, and then they always say, "well it's not YOUR fault, you didn't make it!" or something to that effect. Then if I give them a pass, it's a great PR move.

We never give passes to people who stay for the whole film.

I agree with Jerry that it's a shame that people are now expected to "do research" before they come to a movie.

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Jim Ziegler
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 753
From: West Hollywood, CA
Registered: Jul 99


 - posted 08-08-2001 02:17 PM      Profile for Jim Ziegler   Email Jim Ziegler   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Jerry,

The problem is not the people who leave after a few minutes (like the old folks that came out of our promo screening of Jay and Silet Bob)... THe problem is when people watch the *entire* film and then say they didn't like it...

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Jerry Chase
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1068
From: Margate, FL, USA
Registered: Nov 2000


 - posted 08-08-2001 02:45 PM      Profile for Jerry Chase   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Jim, I understand that part, which is why anyone watching to the end of a film never got a refund, only a pass at best. Generally, my rules were - up to 20 minutes into the feature = no problem, after 20 minutes and until the credit roll refunds got tougher but were possible,and from the start of the credit roll, our part of the contract had been fulfilled. The name of the distributor was happily given out, but only a darned convincing argument got a pass.

Arguably, the contract between a movie-goer and a theatre isn't complete until the moviegoer has seen the entire film. Since the plot of a film generally requires staying to the end, not giving a refund after a ticket purchase that was caused by deceptive advertising could be legally untenable, as well as messy. Movies are not like tires, where a pro-rata refund can be used. Passes are generally accepted, but sometimes a check has to be cut from a corporate office.

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Bill Enos
Film God

Posts: 2081
From: Richmond, Virginia, USA
Registered: Apr 2000


 - posted 08-09-2001 12:29 AM      Profile for Bill Enos   Email Bill Enos   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Passes after no more than 30 minutes for any reason, after that nothing, for any reason other than power failure equipment failure etc.

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Greg Anderson
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 766
From: Ogden Valley, Utah
Registered: Nov 1999


 - posted 08-09-2001 01:21 AM      Profile for Greg Anderson   Author's Homepage   Email Greg Anderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I can't understand why a "bible thumper" would see an R-rated movie... especially one with such sexually-charged advertising. It may be a case of someone who can't deal with his own guilt for having CHOSEN to see a movie which any of us would have known he should have avoided.

It always upset me when the patron wanted to blame me for a bad movie (not a bad presentation). It's as if I were the most immediately available representative of the entertainment industry and the customer wanted to take out his frustration on me. I always wanted to say, "Hey, buddy, I saw the same ads you saw and at least I wasn't still stupid enough to come see this movie!"

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William Hooper
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1879
From: Mobile, AL USA
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 08-09-2001 02:20 AM      Profile for William Hooper   Author's Homepage   Email William Hooper   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I've never heard of a bookstore policy of refunds & returns based on whether a buyer liked what was in the book.


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Jerry Chase
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1068
From: Margate, FL, USA
Registered: Nov 2000


 - posted 08-09-2001 11:54 AM      Profile for Jerry Chase   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Barnes & Noble local stores - absolutely no questions asked on returns as long as you have the receipt from the store. I have returned many books that were not up to snuff even weeks after purchase. I'm fairly sure Borders has a similar policy.

Most bookstores now have cafes and easy chairs so that browsers can sit down and read a few pages or even an entire book. Compare that user-friendliness to theatres, where we have to kick out browsers of movies. It is no coincidence that these bookstores are enjoying a huge increase in popularity and sales while theatre attendence continues to decline on a percentage basis.

"I can't understand why a "bible thumper" would see an R-rated movie... especially one with such sexually-charged advertising. It may be a case of someone who can't deal with his own guilt for having CHOSEN to see a movie which any of us would have known he should have avoided."

I can't see putting myself that deep into a single individual's mind to guess at motivations, especially if I didn't know him personally. I also find it somewhat presumptious to make assumptions about one individual or how others would react to him. To do so depends on a reliance on stereotypes. The comment could be correct, or it could be totally off the mark. The best that could have been done would have been to have asked at the time "Why did you choose this movie in the first place?" The answer is probably innocuous. I've been suckered into dozens of bad sci-fi films just because I like sci-fi and always hope for hidden gems. Other people get suckered into paying for bad sequels. Mistakes are made. People have different tastes and different moral and religious structures.

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Jim Ziegler
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 753
From: West Hollywood, CA
Registered: Jul 99


 - posted 08-09-2001 01:53 PM      Profile for Jim Ziegler   Email Jim Ziegler   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
There are differences between browsing books and browsing movies..

1) If you are browsing movies and decide to go to one you don't have a ticket for, the distributor of that film does not get paid.

2) If the movie you dont have a ticket for but decide to see anyway sells out, a ticket holder may be without a seat.

3) People coming and going out of auditoriums annoys others.

4) In a megaplex, thousands of people wandering about is a security risk

5) The browsers we get now frequently think they can buy one ticket and stay all day. Too many people do this and we go broke.

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