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Author Topic: Barco 32B color Alignment Issue Waqar Azhar Film Handler Posts: 2 From: lahore, Punjab /Punjab, pakistan Registered: Nov 2016 posted 12-20-2018 05:44 AM                     Hi All, i have installed new light engine but facing problem that red color is not align and overlapping on other colors. pls advise how can we fix it. BR Azhar  |  IP: Logged Stephan Shelley Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 854 From: castro valley, CA, usa Registered: Nov 2014 posted 12-20-2018 06:12 PM                     You need to do convergence. There are six nobs under the back side secure cover. There is also a convergence test patter that tells you which nob to turn in which direction. The nobs are numbered. Make sure you know how to clear the temper event that opening the secure cover will cause.  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 12-20-2018 08:54 PM                        Also, unless you have 20/20 vision, a convergence camera, or a spotting scope, then this is unlikely to be something that you can do solo, especially if the throw from projector to screen is a long one. You'll avoid eyestrain and get much better results if you recruit an assistant to stand right in front of the screen and give you directions ("number 5 a hair to the right, please," etc.) through walkies or a cellphone as you operate the knobs on the light engine. It doesn't need to be another tech: anyone will do, who has reasonable eyesight and an explanation of what you are trying to achieve.  |  IP: Logged Dave Macaulay Film God Posts: 2321 From: Toronto, Canada Registered: Apr 2001 posted 12-20-2018 09:00 PM                     Seriously? You installed a light engine but never heard of convergence? Wow.  |  IP: Logged Juan Jose Vazquez Film Handler Posts: 16 From: Queretaro, Queretaro, Mexico Registered: Jun 2018 posted 12-20-2018 10:26 PM                     use the DPxK Convergence Pattern test pattern and a monocular for a better fit. Be patient and turn carefully the knobs that are on top of the Light Engine, the color of the knobs are the DMD.  |  IP: Logged Ioannis Syrogiannis Expert Film Handler Posts: 147 From: Reykjavík, Iceland Registered: Jun 2005 posted 12-21-2018 01:23 AM                     Well, I wouldn't trust a monocular for the convergence procedure and I would even try to remove the glass of the port that I am seeing through. And If I did, I would definately need to validate from up close afterwards. Convergence issues are not the prerogative of the lens and the light engine, it can as well be a glass between the screen and my eyes that refracts light in a different angle for different wavelengths. I have before spotted issues (they are easily detected and acknowledged during the procedure) with my eye glasses and given that my eyesight is not too bad, I prefer assisting the procedure without them. Usually, I ask for help from the projectionist or another person to whom I previously explain the task. When a convergence camera is handy, I definitely go for it. I can't possibly say if the monocular you are using is Hi-Fi, but in my (short) experience, there weren't any I could trust for such applications where titles and subtitles could end up loosing sharpness and being... laureated with different colors. Dave has a point there. Changing a light engine absolutely poses a need for such checks. And taking into account the stakes there, the minimum knowledge of doing the checks, being familiar with the equipment and its mode of operation in such a way, is a prerequisite for changing the light engine.  |  IP: Logged Waqar Azhar Film Handler Posts: 2 From: lahore, Punjab /Punjab, pakistan Registered: Nov 2016 posted 12-21-2018 02:31 AM                     thanks for all to acknowledge. i followed convergence procedure according to PDF file and as you people instructed. when i rotate the knob clockwise and anti clockwise there is no effect on colors on screen. one by one i rotated all knobs as mentioned in PDF file but there is no effect at all. can you people advise how much we can rotate the knob because i rotated all knobs one and half round maximum. BR Azhar  |  IP: Logged Ioannis Syrogiannis Expert Film Handler Posts: 147 From: Reykjavík, Iceland Registered: Jun 2005 posted 12-21-2018 03:34 AM                     You are sharing too little info for us to have the full picture. Do you have the correct test pattern for a 32B projector activated? (It is not the same as for the smaller B series, as the converging lines are drown parallel to the sides of the screen, instead of diagonally.) When you were rotating each knob, where you looking at the part of the screen that the corresponding number (of knob) is appearing? The changes are small and each knob corresponds to only a color and a part of the DMD that projects onto the screen. The more I think of it, the more I wonder if the red that is (I quote:) "overlapping on other colors" is just a convergence issue. One thing I am certain of: If you haven't found the solution by reading the Barco manual and trying, you (and the projector) would be better off if someone who has the skills was showing you the procedure, instead of taking instructions or suggestions from a forum. What a light engine costs is way-way more than a technician's visit. If you just installed a new light engine, you probably should be aware. If I would turn the fonts of the phrase before the previous in bold red and enormous wouldn't be sufficient underlining of the fact. I am not trying to sell something to you here. Edit: A small correction. Where "smaller B series", read "smaller C series"  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 12-21-2018 10:48 AM                        quote: Ioannis Syrogiannis Convergence issues are not the prerogative of the lens and the light engine, it can as well be a glass between the screen and my eyes that refracts light in a different angle for different wavelengths. True, but that glass is going to be in place when the system is in regular operation. I take your point (especially if the port glass is angled), but surely it won't work to set the convergence with the port glass removed from the light path, because when the glass is replaced, the convergence will be thrown out. By the same token, color calibration should be done with the theater's house lighting set as it would be during a show. If you shut the exit boxes and Tivoli lights off (for example, and I've seen techs do this) and shoot the colors in total darkness, the reading from the red, green and blue test patterns will not be exactly the same as it would be in show conditions. Same for tuning with the HVAC shut off, etc. etc. Agreed that Waqar would likely benefit from a visit from a tech, and/or to do the Barco installation and basic maintenance school. Don't know if they do them in Pakistan, though. To be fair to him, swapping out a light engine on a B series is not that complicated: the only real gotcha is being sure to put all the multi-pin connectors back in the correct jacks on the backplane (I almost wonder if one or two of them got swapped, thereby causing his current issue). But as Dave and Ioannis point out, there are adjustments and calibrations that need to happen once you've done that, which is where it seems that Waqar is getting a bit stuck.  |  IP: Logged Dave Macaulay Film God Posts: 2321 From: Toronto, Canada Registered: Apr 2001 posted 12-21-2018 10:58 AM                     "By the same token, color calibration should be done with the theater's house lighting set as it would be during a show. If you shut the exit boxes and Tivoli lights off (for example, and I've seen techs do this) and shoot the colors in total darkness, the reading from the red, green and blue test patterns will not be exactly the same as it would be in show conditions" I can't agree with that. I want to measure the image colors from the projector without extraneous light on the screen - what the site does to ruin their screen image once I have it per spec is their problem. I don't think it make any sense to come up with an MCGD file to attempt compensatation for exit lights or Tivolis putting a colored light wash on screen. And unless it's super bad the projector raw colors should overwhelm any stray light from those sources... Same with HVAC: if it's loud enough to affect audio calibration it gets shut off during tuning. I inform the management that they have a problem, and then it's up to them to fix it or live with it.  |  IP: Logged Sean McKinnon Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1712 From: Peabody Massachusetts Registered: Sep 2000 posted 12-21-2018 11:22 AM                        Keep in mind that the DMD chip is on a pivot so when you adjust the "knobs" you are not really moving the chip laterally or vertically you are causing the chip to pivot on a point. The amount of movement seen on the screen can be pretty slight and sometimes when you lock down the "knobs" they can slip slightly in either direction.  |  IP: Logged Marco Giustini Film God Posts: 2713 From: Reading, UK Registered: Nov 2007 posted 12-21-2018 06:13 PM                     Azhar Usually all you need is a fraction of a turn - you may need a bit more if you end up on a dead spot. If you are rotating the knobs one and a half turn, you’re probably looking at the wrong pattern and you’re likely damaging the engine. I would stop and call someone familiar with the procedure before it’s too late.  |  IP: Logged Ioannis Syrogiannis Expert Film Handler Posts: 147 From: Reykjavík, Iceland Registered: Jun 2005 posted 12-22-2018 08:02 AM                     Leo, what I was talking about there: "it can as well be a glass between the screen and my eyes" is not the projection port glass, but the glass of a window through which I see the screen. Often enough, that is not one and the same. That is the reason I made that rather peculiar choice of words, instead of mentioning the projection port. The same reason that I got to mention my eye glasses just after. What I want to avoid is any interference between the screen and me, not between the projector and the screen. If I can't, I go with help from another party, as I already mentioned. As for learning to do the convergence, one may learn to follow the procedure from another, even if they don't sit a school for it (the best case scenario). Indeed, the courses can be as far as Noida, India, if someone lives in Pakistan (I, myself, had to go to Kortrijk). In any case, though, I strongly believe that if someone doesn't manage to go through it with the detailed instructions of the Barco installation manual, wouldn't be better or more securely guided via a forum, where others are mostly based on assumptions and don't actually know what the situation is.  |  IP: Logged Marcel Birgelen Film God Posts: 3357 From: Maastricht, Limburg, Netherlands Registered: Feb 2012 posted 12-23-2018 04:16 AM                     I consider color convergence a two-man job. One in the room and one at the projector and a bunch of walkie-talkies to communicate witch each other. If you're using the correct test patterns and are unable to fix the offset of your red DMD compared to the others using standard manual color convergence, your light engine might be damaged. I've seen light engines that were damaged during transport, that were so much off-set, it could not be corrected anymore by the manual convergence. I do agree with the sentiment on this topic. If you're spending the money on a new light engine, don't skimp on the qualified technician to install and calibrate the thing. You can easily ruin the most expensive part of your projector by mishandling it... Somehow, when doing those manual convergence calibrations on modern DLP machines, I want back to the days of the old analog CRT projectors, where you could conveniently converge the hell out of every region with your remote in hand.  |  IP: Logged Dave Macaulay Film God Posts: 2321 From: Toronto, Canada Registered: Apr 2001 posted 12-23-2018 09:06 AM                     CRT convergence is not comparable to DMD convergence. The DMD is static, the pixels can not move relative to each other. A CRT image is entirely flexible, the beam deflection system can direct and distort the image freely, limited only by the complexity of the deflection drive electronics. The DLP prism is a very precisely made complex block of optical glass. Getting the three chips to produce an image with all three aligned and in focus is quite a trick. Each pixel on each of the 1.2" DMD chips is about 0.005" square, although my calculation of that is rather suspect.  |  IP: Logged

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