my profile | my password | search | faq & rules | forum home

» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Digital Cinema Forum   » Picture cut-off in scope (Page 1)

This topic comprises 2 pages: 1  2

Author Topic: Picture cut-off in scope Bernardo McLaughlin Film Handler Posts: 8 From: Hartford, CT Registered: Oct 2012 posted 06-22-2014 02:10 PM                     Hi, we just upgraded to DCP and I haven't had a real, proper training yet so that's why I'm gonna sound like a layman here. I haven't had a chance to fiddle with this yet, but the problem is that the aspect ratio of this movie ("Next Goal Wins") seems a bit off. Despite having it set in scope, the picture is still cut-off a bit at the top and bottom. Ordinarily might not be a problem, but portions of it feature subtitles. Thanks for any tips and I'm happy to answer any clarifying questions.  |  IP: Logged Victor Liorentas Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 800 From: london ontario canada Registered: May 2009 posted 06-22-2014 02:28 PM                     You will have to give us projector make and model. Sounds like scope is not set to spec.  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 06-22-2014 02:30 PM                     First, are you sure the movie IS in scope? Remember in digital flat is "letterboxed" within scope (in the simplest form) and there is no anamorphic squeeze, so you can't just look at people in the image and tell if you have the right lens based upon whether they are overly fat or super skinny like you could with 35mm. Try switching to flat. If it fills the height of your screen, that's your problem...it's a flat movie. If it doesn't fill the screen vertically, then you COULD temporarily run it in flat and present it "letterboxed" so at least the customers can see the subtitles. Are your screens curved? That's a great way to lose subtitles due to the typical "smiley-face" distortion. Did you have a real technician install this system? We always go in and rework the screen masking so as to achieve spot-on aspect ratios, but most people just crop and walk away. Also it is possible you don't actually have the proper lens. I see this a lot also with many install companies where they order the lens they think is right, but it actually won't quite reach one end or the other so they simply crop off parts of the picture or scale it (which kills the quality) as opposed to doing the right thing and swapping the lens out for the correct one. The projector make/model would help. Also is the image spilling off of the screen onto the masking, or does it look like it is being cropped off like an aperture plate would so those parts of the image never leave the projector?  |  IP: Logged Bernardo McLaughlin Film Handler Posts: 8 From: Hartford, CT Registered: Oct 2012 posted 06-22-2014 02:51 PM                     The projector is NEC's NC900C The operating system is OS-SA3K-3.0.48 I'm reasonably sure the film is supposed to be in scope. The screen is not curved. We did have a real technician install our system, but as far as I know he didn't mess with the screen besides installing the sound system behind it. The picture is not spilling off the screen, it's more like the aperture plate scenario you described.  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 06-22-2014 03:37 PM                     Try running it in flat first before we continue.  |  IP: Logged Frank Cox Film God Posts: 2234 From: Melville Saskatchewan Canada Registered: Apr 2011 posted 06-22-2014 04:15 PM                        It wouldn't hurt to post the actual filename of the film, too. Most dcp filenames follow a specification that includes the format of the film, among other things.  |  IP: Logged Bernardo McLaughlin Film Handler Posts: 8 From: Hartford, CT Registered: Oct 2012 posted 06-22-2014 04:44 PM                     Says scope on the packaging and the file name contains an 'S' where it would usually indicate scope.  |  IP: Logged Frank Cox Film God Posts: 2234 From: Melville Saskatchewan Canada Registered: Apr 2011 posted 06-22-2014 05:13 PM                        Don't bet your life that it's scope. I haven't had it happen with digital (yet), but I remember playing One Hour Photo. It said scope on the labels on the cans and every one of the reel leaders had "scope" printed on it, too. It was flat.  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 06-22-2014 05:27 PM                     We've already come across MANY DCPs that were improperly labeled. This could be another example. He will find out once he tries to play it in flat.  |  IP: Logged Carsten Kurz Film God Posts: 4340 From: Cologne, NRW, Germany Registered: Aug 2009 posted 06-22-2014 05:44 PM                     'Next Goal Wins' 2014 documentary seems to be referenced on various sites to be scope AR/1:2.4 https://s3.amazonaws.com/tribeca_cms_production/uploads/document/document/5345cf3d55ce63efcc000002/NEXT_GOAL_WINS _press_notes-1.pdf The YouTube Trailer also clearly has a scope AR. As Brad suggests, play it in flat. Pause it, change lens preset on the NEC to scope, then see what happens. If significant top/bottom parts of the image disappear when switching to scope, there is something wrong with the installation. Download these test patterns und store them on your server for a quick check: http://www.freedcp.net/dcp/test/xdc/xdc_test_pattern_XYZ_1-85.zip http://www.freedcp.net/dcp/test/xdc/xdc_test_pattern_XYZ_2-39.zip - Carsten  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 06-22-2014 06:06 PM                     If it is JUST the subtitles that are wacked (off the screen)...(but credits and such are all appearing okay...people's heads are not chopped off)...then watch out on the PCF file being used. NEC normally has people use the "Auto" file and there is nothing auto about it. It is full-container with the pixel size defined as 0 x 0. Subtitles use the image size as the reference and if your server (which you didn't specify) hands off the image as a 4K file and your NEC is only a 2K projector (which it is), then the subtitles will be in the wrong place since they are referenced off of the bottom and center of the image. In the Titles, the PCF should be set to define scope as 2048x858 with an AR of 2.39 or Auto-Square Pixels. Likewise on Flat, make sure the PCF has the defined resolution of 1998x1080 and an AR of 1.85 or Auto Square Pixels. If you have an IMB system (most are now), then it is important that it is set up as a 2K output only.  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 10-30-2014 07:49 PM                        Many thanks Steve. We were having precisely this problem playing a 2K scope subtitled DCP (Waiting for August) through our DSS200, cat745 and NC3240S, and changing the PCF settings as you suggest and creating a "2K Scope Subtitled DCP" title/button for them has solved it.  |  IP: Logged Peter Castle Expert Film Handler Posts: 220 From: Wollongong University, NSW ,Australia Registered: Oct 2003 posted 10-30-2014 08:55 PM                     Not quite on the same topic, but we tried to display an OCAP version of a DCP recently. The movie was "Annabelle", server GDC and projector NEC3240 - and the feature was scope. The captions had the second line's descenders off screen - in the unused pixels of the DLP. Is there a way of moving them or is it, as our installer felt, a production error?  |  IP: Logged Dave Macaulay Film God Posts: 2321 From: Toronto, Canada Registered: Apr 2001 posted 10-30-2014 10:22 PM                     Are you certain that the captions were outside the 858 height of the scope image? If so, this is a production error. I believe that OCAP versions have the captions already in the image files, they are not inserted "on the fly" - so the PCF setting would have no impact on them (although it really can bugger up CCAP captioning). It is pretty unusual to crop scope images from top or bottom but it could be done, especially if keystoning is extreme. Try setting a screen file with Y cutting off <111 and >969, zoom to see the entire height of that image, and see what's on screen.  |  IP: Logged Peter Castle Expert Film Handler Posts: 220 From: Wollongong University, NSW ,Australia Registered: Oct 2003 posted 10-30-2014 11:09 PM                     If we display the scope image with a flat setting, the descenders are there - in the black below the image.  |  IP: Logged

All times are Central (GMT -6:00)

This topic comprises 2 pages: 1  2

Printer-friendly view of this topic

Hop To: Select a Forum: Category: Operations -------------------- Digital Cinema Forum Film Handlers' Forum Large Format Forum Ground Level Feature Info, Trailer Attachments & REAL Credit Offsets Category: Community -------------------- Film-Yak Film Handlers' Movie Reviews The Afterlife Bob Maar's Joke-A-Thon Category: Classified -------------------- Equipment and Supplies Wanted/For Sale Help Wanted/Seeking Employment Category: System -------------------- Software Beta Testing Forum

The Film-Tech Forums are designed for various members related to the cinema industry to express their opinions, viewpoints and testimonials on various products, services and events based upon speculation, personal knowledge and factual information through use, therefore all views represented here allow no liability upon the publishers of this web site and the owners of said views assume no liability for any ill will resulting from these postings. The posts made here are for educational as well as entertainment purposes and as such anyone viewing this portion of the website must accept these views as statements of the author of that opinion and agrees to release the authors from any and all liability.