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Author Topic: 3D spinning disk
Jonathan Bodge
Film Handler

Posts: 83
From: East Dorset, VT
Registered: Nov 2006


 - posted 11-16-2008 04:27 PM      Profile for Jonathan Bodge   Email Jonathan Bodge   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I saw in a booth here in Connecticut a "Master Image" spinning disk 3d rig that sits in front of the video projector lens. Any of you seen the results with this apparatus at Showeast?

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 11-16-2008 05:48 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Yep, Its good but no better than any other single projector 3-D system... Two projectors still provide far better results. I'm puttn one of these in next month so I could report back then! Its also very expensive but utilizes CP glasses....

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Jonathan Bodge
Film Handler

Posts: 83
From: East Dorset, VT
Registered: Nov 2006


 - posted 11-19-2008 06:33 PM      Profile for Jonathan Bodge   Email Jonathan Bodge   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I am anxious to get Marks reviews on this, I also find it somewhat humorous that in this whole wide world he's the only one who responded...can't be too popular.

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 11-19-2008 07:23 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
JOnathan, Its quite expensive! In the mid 30's. I still feel the Dolby 3-D system is the better way to go in spite of the 7 grand dishwasher.

Mark

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Frank Angel
Film God

Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 11-19-2008 09:31 PM      Profile for Frank Angel   Author's Homepage   Email Frank Angel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Mark, is that dishwasher required by Dolby or can the theatre go with a more conventional washer. Surely there are commercial restaurant washers that can clean as well as whatever this uber expensive unit can do.

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Tristan Lane
Master Film Handler

Posts: 444
From: Nampa, Idaho
Registered: Feb 2002


 - posted 11-19-2008 09:46 PM      Profile for Tristan Lane   Email Tristan Lane   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Any commercial low-temp dishwasher will work.

Hell, you can use a standard undercounter low-temp dishwasher to sanitize the glasses as long as you use the proper chemicals.

We use our bar glassware dishwasher to santize the glasses. I've seen these on Craigslist for as low as 500 bucks. I DO recommend a booster heater (as dolby does) so that you avoid spotting.

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 11-19-2008 10:11 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Frank, I was told that there is actually a theater in Spokane doing it all by hand in a triple basin sink... but still using the proper chemicals so it meets health standards.

This dishwasher is very similar to what Dolby reccomends right down to the three chemical metering units on top.

I was told by one of our customers that the key to the whole thing is to have a 50 gallon hot water heater for what ever dish washer you use and as Tristian mentioned the proper chemicals... they should cost you under 200 bucks for the three 5 gallon pails total. They will last a very long time. The dishwasher Dolby reccomends only usees 1.5 gallons of water per cycle.

Tristian... if you could specify a model number on that dishwasher it would be greatly appreciated.

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Tristan Lane
Master Film Handler

Posts: 444
From: Nampa, Idaho
Registered: Feb 2002


 - posted 11-20-2008 01:13 AM      Profile for Tristan Lane   Email Tristan Lane   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The exact model we use is an ADS Dishmachine ET-AF

Instawares link is here

This unit is listed at 3000. Street price is less than that. I picked up a used one that I have for parts for 400.00 from a reastaurant nearby that was closing.
Any low-temp 3-chemical unit will work. As long as the water is at 160 degrees or better, spotting shouldn't be a problem if you use the rinse agent and have soft water. The chemicals specified by Dolby are a detergent, rinse-aid, and sanitizer. All traditional low-temp restaurant units use similar chemicals.

Edit: I might also add that many restaurants out there lease their dishwashers for a monthly rate and price-per-load fee with chemicals and maintenence included.

I think IN3 (the active glasses 3D company) was actually marketing a residential grade "modified" Fisher & Paykel dishwasher for sanitizing their activie glasses.

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 02-05-2009 06:31 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
This week I installed the Master Image 3-D system along with a tech from Master Image. All went pretty well except that the DP-100 was a very early unit and it required a new card cage backplane. The Master Image needs the pulse from GPIO-1 to sync and the old backplane wasn't intended to output this pulse... pre 3-D days of 2K stuff! However, and for you people that preach the obsolescence of D-Cinema gear... BARCO graciously supplied the new backplane free of charge. Once the backplane was installed and the BARCO re-assembled (no small task), the Master Image synced right up and worked beautifully.

Build quality of the Master Image is very high and the spinning disk drive motor is direct drive and utilizes a brushless servo drive system of very high quality.

How does it compare to other 3-D systems??? I have to completely take back what I said in my post above... This is NOT EQUAL to other single projector 3-D systems... it is FAR SUPERIOR... Simply put, this is THE BEST single projector 3-D I have seen to date and also the brightest. We acheived 5.7 fl with just a 4kw cinema type lamp (not a short gap) running at about 80%. I know there are downsides to Silver Screens which this system does require but the upside of the super high quality 3-D easily makes for putting up with the silver suurface. We hung a new type Hurley "washable" silver screen at this location in preperation for this install late last year. This screen has been tested by Master Image's technical staff whom themselves are involved with testing every toher 3-D system out there for DCIP.. in short they are way overqualified to do this sort of testing. Their conclusion was very positive and even Coke spills on this screen won't damage it's surface.

So combine the new Hurley Washable Silver Surface with the Master Image 3-D system in front of a full frame triple flash projector and you'd have one killer 3-D system that easily knocks the socks off the rest of em. This one certainly does.

 -

Mark

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Julio Roberto
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 938
From: Madrid, Madrid, Spain
Registered: Oct 2008


 - posted 02-06-2009 09:09 AM      Profile for Julio Roberto     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Glad to hear a decent alternative to R€al-d exists that can use inexpensive polarized glasses.

I would imagine the ghosting to be about the same (or better) than Real-D as well. Dolby would still be champion here, but at a significant light loss and worse colour space.

And the Master Image would be cheaper too.

I would recommend this system for those not willing to go the dual-projection route until Dolby glasses come down to a price point that the profits truly offsets the inconvinience and risk.

Thanks for your report, Mark!!!!

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Mark J. Marshall
Film God

Posts: 3188
From: New Castle, DE, USA
Registered: Aug 2002


 - posted 02-06-2009 09:55 AM      Profile for Mark J. Marshall     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
What does the spinning disk do exactly? Is it basically performing the same functions as that z-screen thing and alternating between circular polarization directions?

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Julio Roberto
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 938
From: Madrid, Madrid, Spain
Registered: Oct 2008


 - posted 02-06-2009 11:03 AM      Profile for Julio Roberto     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Mark J. Marshall
What does the spinning disk do exactly? Is it basically performing the same functions as that z-screen thing and alternating between circular polarization directions?
No more, no less [Smile] Just a left and right circular polarizer mounted on a disc made to spin in synch with the projector so that 144 times a second the top part covers the image area in either left or right direction.

And yes. It spins FAST.

How noisy is it (i.e. the engine), Mark? Obviously less than a 35m projector [Wink] ... but just wondering if it sounds like a high speed fan or it's actually really quiet.

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Monte L Fullmer
Film God

Posts: 8367
From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
Registered: Nov 2004


 - posted 02-06-2009 01:17 PM      Profile for Monte L Fullmer   Email Monte L Fullmer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Have a peek on this product here.

Yet, kinda funny: First - we return to the "sound on disk" format being DTS. Second - we return to the front shutter of an old Powers 6B projector ...

..I find that a bit amusing.. [Big Grin]

-Monte

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 02-06-2009 03:46 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Julio Roberto
And yes. It spins FAST.

4320 RPM! Don't get the fingys caught in this! It sounds like a small window fan set to low speed. The disk does a LR-LR-LR polarization... as long as you have the disk on properly... or turn your glasses upside down!

It can be set to automatically sense the 72hz square wave on GPO 1. So with a BARCO for instance you can add the GPO function into the macro just for the 3-D channels. So when you go to a 2-D channel the disk stops spinning. In normal mode the disk spins fast when it gets the 72 hz wave and it slows to about half speed when it doesn't get the signal. There is an elevation mechanism to drop the disk below the height of the lens when it's not in use... but alas that part is not automatic and it moves quite slowly. There are internal limit switches to set the up/down range. Personally mounting it on a small 3 foot track system would be the way to go... and inexpensive... as you could roll it out of the way in about 5 seconds.

I now do really believe this is the best quality and most practical way to go for 3-D!

Mark

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Monte L Fullmer
Film God

Posts: 8367
From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
Registered: Nov 2004


 - posted 02-07-2009 02:35 AM      Profile for Monte L Fullmer   Email Monte L Fullmer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
On the front end of that unit, for safety protection, one could almost fabricate a set of "blinders" on each side and top of that opening..like a shroud of sorts..

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