Film-Tech Cinema Systems
Film-Tech Forum


Post New Topic  Post A Reply
my profile | my password | register | search | faq & rules | forum home
  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» Film-Tech Forum   » Community   » The Afterlife   » KINOTON FP 30 D LAMP CONVERSION

   
Author Topic: KINOTON FP 30 D LAMP CONVERSION
Nigel Pickles
Film Handler

Posts: 6
From: Waterfoot Lancs Eng
Registered: Feb 2011


 - posted 04-26-2015 12:42 PM      Profile for Nigel Pickles   Email Nigel Pickles   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I have a kinoton FP30D Projector which i wish to fit a smaller lamp, it currently has a reflector in place & the 2000 watt lamp removed. I have managed to source a 400 watt 36 volt lamp, which I was told would be fine.
I'm having trouble achieving brightness, maybe I'm not positioning the lamp in relation to the reflector correctly??
Could anyone give me some advise or maybe a better lamp solution.
Nigel

 |  IP: Logged

Jonathan Wood
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 194
From: Oxfordshire, United kingdom
Registered: Jan 2008


 - posted 04-26-2015 02:14 PM      Profile for Jonathan Wood   Email Jonathan Wood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Nigel
You might have more luck posting this in the film handlers forum rather than this one. I did a very similar thing with an fp40 last year . If when u say 2000w lamp you mean a xenon in a proper 2k lamp house , then you will struggle getting a bright enough picture using the 36v lamp because the reflector is designed for axe on lamp where the 'hot spot' is right at the back of the reflector. Plus , you can't get the 36v lamp close enough to the film plane because of the shutter housing ; most of the light energy is lost inside the lamp house and only a small fraction makes it through the gate. I was experimenting with 650w AC lamps and even these struggled to get anything more than a pic a few feet wide . In fact an ELC 250w/24v lamp ( as used in most 16mm machines ) gave a brighter picture., the bottom line is it isn't about raw power in watts , it's about optical efficiency , and that 36v lamp as it is just won't do it. You could try the ELC lamp , it's built in reflector makes it more efficient than the 36v lamp , or you could get hold of an old 35mm slide projector , remove the condenser lens assembly and insert this into your lamp house with the 36v lamp in place and it might just work. Good luck

 |  IP: Logged

Nigel Pickles
Film Handler

Posts: 6
From: Waterfoot Lancs Eng
Registered: Feb 2011


 - posted 04-27-2015 03:10 PM      Profile for Nigel Pickles   Email Nigel Pickles   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks for that Jonathan, I Think the ELC 250w/24v lamp is my best option, I Presume it will have to be located closer to the gate compared to the previous lamp.Do you know what the ideal temperature at the gate and near the lamp should ideally be.There is a fan/blower already located at the rear of the lamp and blows straight through the hole in the reflector, obviously I will have to relocate this.
Cheers Nigel

 |  IP: Logged

Jeff Taylor
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 601
From: Chatham, NJ/East Hampton, NY
Registered: Apr 2000


 - posted 04-27-2015 04:24 PM      Profile for Jeff Taylor   Email Jeff Taylor   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
FWIW, 16mm designs using the ELC generally locate the rim of the lamp right behind the shutter which is generally not more than 1/4" or so behind the gate. You'll have to experiment a bit, but in a word it should be very close to the gate. Good luck.

 |  IP: Logged

Richard Fowler
Film God

Posts: 2389
From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA
Registered: Jun 2001


 - posted 04-27-2015 05:22 PM      Profile for Richard Fowler   Email Richard Fowler   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
ELH is a better bulb since it is usually used in slide projectors. It has a working distance 154.3mm (6 inch +) without a corrective condenser. Kinoton had a 400 watt / 36 volt lamp kit with corrective lens and reflector which would fit into the shutter housing.

 |  IP: Logged

Jonathan Wood
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 194
From: Oxfordshire, United kingdom
Registered: Jan 2008


 - posted 04-28-2015 03:46 AM      Profile for Jonathan Wood   Email Jonathan Wood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Nigel, as Jeff said you will need to get the lamp as close to the shutter as is safely possible . There will certainly be a substantial build up of heat and the shutter housing itself is likely to become very hot , so you will need to be wary of this. I doubt the fan in the lamphouse will do much so it would be wise to add another fan closer to the gate . I doubt the heat build up will damage anything , but you might want to the douser is ok as this will also be in the line of fire. I think your best option will be to use a lens/condenser arrangement with something like either the 400/36 DC lamp or a 650w/230ac lamp . Don't worry about flicker from the ac lamp , you won't see it. Jon

 |  IP: Logged

Jim Cassedy
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1553
From: San Francisco, CA
Registered: Dec 2006


 - posted 04-28-2015 05:28 PM      Profile for Jim Cassedy   Email Jim Cassedy   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Richard Fowler
ELH is a better bulb since it is usually used in slide projectors.
Just out of curiosity, does the ELH need forced cooling?

 |  IP: Logged

Richard Fowler
Film God

Posts: 2389
From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA
Registered: Jun 2001


 - posted 04-28-2015 09:03 PM      Profile for Richard Fowler   Email Richard Fowler   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Forced air to keep bulb reflector temperature at 288 degree C / 550 degree F. Too much cooling will interfere with the tungsten - halogen cycle and will short the bulb life. I have built lamp houses for optical printers long ago and a proper sized muffin fan was O.K.

 |  IP: Logged

Nigel Pickles
Film Handler

Posts: 6
From: Waterfoot Lancs Eng
Registered: Feb 2011


 - posted 05-03-2015 11:37 AM      Profile for Nigel Pickles   Email Nigel Pickles   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks for the Info Guys, much appreciated.Is there any lamp on the market either mains or low voltage which I could use to make use of the existing reflector so as to keep the lamp house in an original state as possible??? Cheers, Nigel

 -

 |  IP: Logged



All times are Central (GMT -6:00)  
Post New Topic  Post A Reply Close Topic    Move Topic    Delete Topic    next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:



Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classicTM 6.3.1.2

The Film-Tech Forums are designed for various members related to the cinema industry to express their opinions, viewpoints and testimonials on various products, services and events based upon speculation, personal knowledge and factual information through use, therefore all views represented here allow no liability upon the publishers of this web site and the owners of said views assume no liability for any ill will resulting from these postings. The posts made here are for educational as well as entertainment purposes and as such anyone viewing this portion of the website must accept these views as statements of the author of that opinion and agrees to release the authors from any and all liability.

© 1999-2018 Film-Tech Cinema Systems, LLC. All rights reserved.