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Author Topic: LCD TV image quality Michael Schaffer "Where is the Boardwalk Hotel?" Posts: 4143 From: Boston, MA Registered: Apr 2002 posted 04-10-2005 04:33 AM                        I won an LG RU-20LA80C 20" LCD TV in a drawing recently. Since I did't have a TV before and rarely watch TV anyway, I saw that as a sign of fate and ordered TV services. But I have to say I am quite disappointed with the actual image quality. I have cable TV now, but even with DVDs the image quality is way below what I know from CRT TVs. Especially the contrast and sharpness are not very good, colors are not very natural and the whole image is rather pixely and has edge artifacts. Even after setting it up with the "THX optimizer" found on some DVDs, and some more subjective fine tuning, I still find the image quality hardly watchable. What bothers me most is that the backlight shines through the panel unevenly. The top right and bottom left corner are brighter than the rest of the image. It looks like the backlight is actually spilling through on the sides. What are your experiences with LCD TVs, from LG and other manufacturers?  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 04-10-2005 07:50 AM                        I've seen some LCDs that look decent, but the black levels are always a problem. At least it's better than plasma, which has to be the most overrated technology ever. I have yet to see a plasma TV with a picture that looks good to my eyes.  |  IP: Logged Jennifer Pan THE JEN! Posts: 1219 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: Nov 2003 posted 04-10-2005 10:14 AM                        Michael, the dang thing was free... I doubt anything like a LCD TV would turn out to be perfect. There has to be something wrong with it. You should have just returned it at Wal-mart without a receipt, taken the store credit, and bought yourself something pretty! And no way could I pay for TV, it's bad enough that cable companies charge for local broadcast channels. Well, obviously something with a higher resolution would be better. Your 640 x 480 is just standard. Compared to what quiet a few other LCD screens are 1024 x 768 and above or maybe because they have non-interlaced(XGA) or (WXGA) resolution instead of the VGA.  |  IP: Logged David Stambaugh Film God Posts: 4021 From: Eugene, Oregon Registered: Jan 2002 posted 04-10-2005 11:04 AM                        Uneven backlighting in LCDs is inexcusable these days. Every LCD manufacturer should at least be able to get THAT right. Black levels are still the biggest weak point of LCD. It's more like "dark bluish-gray levels" than black. Sony's top of the line rear-projection LCD sets get the black levels better than anyone else's LCDs (to a point that I find acceptable), but even they can't match CRTs. As for plasma, the apparent success of that technology is a mystery to me. They never look good to my eyes, and their problems with image burning make them not worth my consideration. I can't warm up to single-chip DLP either because just knowing there's something called a "color wheel" in there just isn't very appealing to me. All in all, it seems like LCD has the greatest promise right now. But that could change tomorrow (and probably will).  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 04-10-2005 12:15 PM                        My LCD computer monitor is freakin' awesome, but I don't think any TVs are made as well as an Apple Cinema Display. My aunt has an LCD HDTV (is yours HDTV? Is it widescreen?). It's not bad. It is a JVC and I can't see any edge artifacts other than a bit of ghosting in the menus and whatnot. It was a mid-range quality TV (27 inches widescreen) that she got for a discount because she worked for Ultimate Electronics Corporate and she got it in the goin-outta-bidness-sale. Anyway, false colors are a big problem with LCD, and that's a reason why I can't work in Photoshop with an LCD monitor (except for my ACD). Mid to low range LCDs will have a hard time distinguishing between red and green in the small details. The mouse cursor also turns to fuzz when it moves (again, except on my ACD). Consumer pocketbook friendly LCD has a long way to go.  |  IP: Logged Paul Mayer Oh get out of it Melvin, before it pulls you under! Posts: 3836 From: Albuquerque, NM Registered: Feb 2000 posted 04-10-2005 12:24 PM                        I've never been impressed with any of LG's pictures. In the LCD world Panasonic, Sony (their new 2k SXRD imager), and JVC seem to have a good handle on implementing the technology. FWIW the current 50" Panasonic LCD is what gets used for DVD picture evaluations over at AnimeOnDVD. I've seen it and it is quite good. Fill factor is very high and black levels, though still too high, are getting better. In a lit room you'd hardly notice them anyway. As for plasma--me too thinks, "Meh." I don't give a shit if I can hang the damn thing on a wall. At plasma prices the only "cool" factor I care about is the picture. Plasma just ain't cool enough, not to my eyes anyway. I've also yet to be impressed with real-world HD pictures as delivered over cable. Cable companies vary widely in pix quality, even within the same market area. Was in the neighborhood Ultimate Electronics last night (roommate just got his bonus and was drooling over a $1600 55" Mits which may end up in the house in a couple of weeks). The HDNet pictures they were using in the showroom just didn't satisfy. I know I'm spoiled since I regularly see HD as good as it gets--on the match monitors inside HDTV production trucks and studios. And I know that even with digital distribution there is a drop-off in pix quality between the truck and the living room. But that drop-off is still disappointly large, still too much like the analog days of NTSC and PAL. Except NTSC and PAL degrade more gracefully.  |  IP: Logged Darryl Spicer Film God Posts: 3250 From: Lexington, KY, USA Registered: Dec 2000 posted 04-10-2005 01:11 PM                    I don't like the look of plasma screens. THe images look so fake with no depth. Almost like watching a coloring book on the screen. LCD looks to washed out in the black levels wich is very anoying.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 04-10-2005 02:56 PM                     Michael, What it the claimed resolution of your set in pixels....XXX-x- XXXX ? Will it do HD or near HD resoltion? I find that non-HD capable LCD sets are generally pretty crappy looking but that HD capable sets look far better and little to no pixilation or artifacts. Since you won it sell it off and get a better set. Pay for TV pogramming.... NEVER! There's plenty of good free HD programming over the airwaves for free. __________________________ quote: Paul Mayer In the LCD world Panasonic, Sony (their new 2k SXRD imager), and JVC seem to have a good handle on implementing the technology. Actually I dislike the Panasonics but they are a great company with one of the best customer support operations in the industry, haven't paid attention to Sony because I dislike Sony in general. When it comes to anything LCD the best bet to getting the best picture quality is to buy from the two giants that manufacture 95% of the LCD panels in the world and that is Samsung or Sharp. Not only do they own most of the patents but they are also going to reserve the best technology derived from their manufacturing experience for their own marketing divisions!! I have a 17" Samsung LCD HD set and Motorola micro HD tuner in my bedroom and it looks excellent, has little to no artifacts of its own and has excellent colorimetry, almost no perceptable "ghosting", or "Lag'. You have to have your eyes right up to the screen to even see the pixels. Head end artifacts that are broadcast do show up though as they will on CRT sets, especially from old HD programming made during the first year or so of HD broadcasting. Keep in mind that none of the available technology...LCD, Plasma, and DLP. The Samsung HD LCD's make even the better plasma sets look like crap! quote: Paul Mayer Was in the neighborhood Ultimate Electronics last night (roommate just got his bonus and was drooling over a $1600 55" Mits which may end up in the house in a couple of weeks). Best to look at Ultimate and then buy it some place else. I've been shafted by them in regards to my Mitsubishi HD set more than once. The last time they stung me was when I took my Mits dedicated tuner to them to send to Mits for repair and I've never seen it again.... that was almost year and a half ago! I really ought to hire an attourney and go after them !! They offer absolutely zero customer service after the sale! Also, they are closing several stores in this area so this may also be a hint of their impending doom Hopefully! Mark  |  IP: Logged Jennifer Pan THE JEN! Posts: 1219 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: Nov 2003 posted 04-10-2005 03:12 PM                        On the LG.Philips LCD web site they are claiming to be the World's #1 LCD company... Yeah, right... And isn't LG supposedly the first company to come out with an LCD monitor on a refrigerator. I doubt I'll spend that much time in my kitchen.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 04-10-2005 03:28 PM                     Jen, I thought you were into the chocloate chip cookie thing by baking at home and were giving Mrs Fields a run for her chips.... You'll need one of those refridgerator tv sets won"t ya? Actually I thought they were two different companies?? LG is a Korean company and Phillips a Dutch Company..... perhaps they were recently bought up along with MGM and UA to be folded into some closet at Sony. Mark  |  IP: Logged Jennifer Pan THE JEN! Posts: 1219 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: Nov 2003 posted 04-10-2005 03:33 PM                        It looks like they combined forces from the looks of this site. http://www.lgphilips-lcd.com/homeContain/jsp/eng/common/cmn000_j_e.jsp Mark, I'm not much of a cook. But if I tried... I'll be living in a studio loft and have a huge Flat Screen HDTV positioned just right to be able to see from the kitchen. With surround sound BABY! Forget that little tiny 12" stuck to the frig.  |  IP: Logged Michael Schaffer "Where is the Boardwalk Hotel?" Posts: 4143 From: Boston, MA Registered: Apr 2002 posted 04-10-2005 04:51 PM                        This one only has 640x480. The backlight is really uneven, and as Joe also mentioned, colors are a real problem with this one too. Well, I won it, so it cost me absolutely nothing, but I wouldn't spend anything like the about $700 it costs for it. I also thought about ebaying it and getting a nicer CRT, but somehow that seems "wrong" to me. After all, fate decided I should have it...  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 04-10-2005 07:56 PM                     Yea, 680 X 480, thats poor resolution thats for sure, not as good as most laptops. Take a good look at Samsung and Sharp direct view LCD sets before you buy CRT. CRT's are actually getting obsolete...... I bought my Samsung on sale at Best Buy for just under 800 and the HD Tunner was about 250 on sale at Circuit City. I have no compalints about it and I used to work in television....... This is one panel that can easily keep up with the action in a football game!! Also be wary of sets that have seemingly goofy image enhancement stuff built in. Too much aperature correctionm in any set can lead you into thinking that a Tv has great resolution when in reality is really doesn't. Get your self a copy of the Video Test Standard DVD if you're really fussy about pix quality.  |  IP: Logged Paul Mayer Oh get out of it Melvin, before it pulls you under! Posts: 3836 From: Albuquerque, NM Registered: Feb 2000 posted 04-10-2005 08:17 PM                        Yeah keep it Michael. You can use it as a second screen when you get something better. FWIW Sony is growing their own LCD (SXRD) imagers now. They've also abandoned plasma displays as of this year. They've had some problems getting the yields up on their LCD production lines (don't remember if it's both the 2k and 4k lines or just the 4k), so it'll be interesting to watch how they do on these rollouts. My roommate gets points (dollars) from Canon on printer and scanner sales through his employer, but Canon restricts where the points can be redeemed. Ultimate is on the list, Best Buy was just taken off the list. The Mits he looked at last night is a 55515 for $1800 and change which is a good price for a CRT RPTV with built-in ATSC OTA tuner, CableCard slot, and FireWire input. I've passed along the warnings about Ultimate. The salesman last night didn't know what he was talking about--tried to tell us the lamps in the LCD sets are good for 30,000 hours. Sounds like some theater owners I know. We'll see how this plays out.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 04-10-2005 09:06 PM                     quote: Paul Mayer The salesman last night didn't know what he was talking about--tried to tell us the lamps in the LCD sets are good for 30,000 hours. Well, that statement is close for direct view LCD sets... about 50,000 hours. Mark  |  IP: Logged

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