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Author Topic: USL DAX 602 vs Dolby DA20 opinons Ian Parfrey Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1049 From: Imbil Australia 26 deg 27' 42.66" S 152 deg 42' 23.40" E Registered: Feb 2009 posted 11-29-2011 03:01 AM                     Here is the situation I'm facing. My location is slowly coming round to easing the purse strings and may allow me to purchase a Digital processor. The current setup is Cinemeccanica Vic 8 with Panastereo CSP 4200. The basement readers are there for analogue and Dolby Digital but do not have the data cable from the DD head just yet. As far as I can tell, my options in getting digital soundtracks read from 35mm are the DA 20/DA 10 or the USL DAX 602. Has anyone had some experience with the DAX, and if so is it worth a spin considering the $$$ are few and far between. Thanks for any input.  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 11-29-2011 09:56 AM                        Does it read Dolby Digital? Louis  |  IP: Logged Christos Mitsakis Expert Film Handler Posts: 242 From: Ag.Paraskevi, ATHENS, GREECE Registered: Sep 1999 posted 11-29-2011 09:57 AM                     Ian, As far as I understand the DAX602 (I have never used or handled one) is a Dolby DMA8Plus equivalent and does not decode the dolby digital video signal form the digital reader. If you do want 35mm dolby digital decoding a DA20 is mandatory to pair your CSP4200. The DA10 is ancient history and not recommended even if you find one. There are a lot of DA20s coming out from cinemas that have converted to digital at a very nice prices. Christos.  |  IP: Logged Tony Bandiera Jr Film God Posts: 3067 From: Moreland Idaho Registered: Apr 2004 posted 11-29-2011 12:34 PM                     Ian, If possible, forget the DA20 and any other combinations of Digital Decoder/Processor..why? Used CP650's are really cheap now, Around $3500 USD or less. Contact Moving Images Technologies (Bevan's company) as they frequently get CP-650's from cinemas doing digital upgrades. Many other processors are in the no longer available/supported category and it would be foolish to invest in them, even in the short term IMHO. (If you ever need to get rid of the CP650 odds are that unlike any of the obsolete processors, it will still have some resale value.) Bonus: A CP650 with the CAT 790 card installed (easy to get in the price range I quoted) WILL be digital cinema ready.  |  IP: Logged Sam D. Chavez Film God Posts: 2153 From: Martinez, CA USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 11-29-2011 01:34 PM                       I would agree with Tony if you can stretch your budget a bit. The 650 is still in new production so there will be repair support for quite a while. The DA20 is still supported so it's not a bad bargain these days. As to the DAX 602, it is not a substitute for the DMA8. That would be a USL ECI 60. The DAX is a much simpler, one multi channel input DAC where the ECI or DMA8 offer several sets of inputs with switching, and one 8 channel output.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 11-30-2011 09:13 AM                     The DAX 602 is right now the least expensive route to decoding AES digital audio for D-Cinema if you intend on keeping your CP-65, USL or Panastereo analog processor... I honestly can't believe the number of perfectly good analog processors being yanked these days!! Mark  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 11-30-2011 09:32 AM                        Mark: For once in our lives "cost is no onject!" Louis  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 11-30-2011 09:43 AM                     Actually, I think the Doremi A/D device is the "cheapest" means of retaining an analog processor. The reasons are many for taking this opportunity to "yank" perfectly good analog processors. * The signal is digital and can remain that way up to the amps. * Volume control, most analog processors don't provide a good means of letting a DCinema player control the volume so the previews and feature may have different volume levels. * Sound quality, most analog processors (the Panastereo being a notable exception), are a bit noisy and many have wanting EQ circuits, Pana and Dolby being notable exceptions. * Support, most of the analog or film based cinema processors have limited or NO support, at this point. The CP650 and JSD80 have support as film processors but they are digital units and integrate well with DCinema. * Cost for DCinema processors (or most any digitally capable processor) is just not that high, particularly as compared to what a film based processor used to cost. The highest cost is probably Datasat's AP20...but it has more than the basics in their...it is full-blown DSP box with matrix routing. On the other end, the JSD100 by USL and CP750 by Dolby are little more than adding a D/A. * Age. Many of these analog processors are now getting pretty long in the tooth, as some would say. Give the support possibilities, getting a new processor is likely a sooner or late proposition. * Flexibility, a DCinema processor often has a means to play Alternate content in a high quality/digital manner in addition to the DCinema audio. -Steve  |  IP: Logged Sam D. Chavez Film God Posts: 2153 From: Martinez, CA USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 11-30-2011 09:51 AM                       We live in strange times for sure. Mostly it's greed about labor costs, no more paying that kid upstairs, what was his name anyway? Someone's in for a surprise or two.  |  IP: Logged Dave Macaulay Film God Posts: 2321 From: Toronto, Canada Registered: Apr 2001 posted 11-30-2011 09:37 PM                     Well, Sam, this time you're shooting over my head. What did that mean? I have to go with Steve. I've been putting in a lot of digital retrofits and using an existing film CP is adequate but putting in a new D-cinema processor is the way to go. Having ethernet control of the processor is a huge advantage in presenting the best show possible: we can have any fader level we want for each show segment rather than adjusting the knob so that trailers are tolerable and the feature is not too quiet. The CP750 EQ assist can be abused (OK, it's probably abused most of the time) but in competent hands it gives a decent base EQ to work from, and being able to tune live in the room with a wireless link is considerably better than tuning a CP55/65 with an extender card - my legs don't handle that many trips up and down the stairs so well any more. I don't know the cost difference between a new D-A for an "old " CP and a current D-cinema CP. The jobs I've done lately though, the ones with a new CP750 are definitely a better customer experience than the ones with a D-A feeding a CP55. If you have the flexibility (ie no VPF program charging you for non-Hollywood shows) to do alternate content the CP750 is not quite a DMA8+ but it handles most alternate digital sources, and I think a CP750 is cheaper than a DMA8+. We've been using the Doremi D-A for legacy CPs, and I don't have much experience with the others yet. The Doremi AUD-2A is a dedicated 4xAES D-cinema D-A converter, it has no alternate inputs.  |  IP: Logged Sam D. Chavez Film God Posts: 2153 From: Martinez, CA USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 11-30-2011 10:26 PM                       Hi Dave, I promise to stop posting before I'm awake if some others (not you) promise to stop posting after partaking. I was following up on Louis' comment, but Steve posted first, making it look even more like a non sequitur.  |  IP: Logged Richard Hamilton Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1341 From: Evansville, Indiana Registered: Jan 2000 posted 12-01-2011 02:40 AM                     quote: Sam D. Chavez if some others (not you) promise to stop posting after partaking. But Sam, thats when my true sarcasm comes out. Rick  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 12-01-2011 05:31 AM                     Granted I have pulled many analog units out too but with proper gain structure the SN can be decent at least on the old JS series. But to pull a perfectly good CP-65 out makes no sense to me. I recently re-installed one of the latter(on a D-Cinema Screen in fact). I couldn't bear to leave it behind to rot in the booth... I can sertainly see yanking Smart, Peavey, ALL Sony's even though the 3000 has 6 track inputs it is not worth the hassle to repair when it drops, and a few other really old units too. Mark  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 12-01-2011 06:35 AM                     Your hearing is going...the S/N of JS and even Dolby CP65s and CP500s are not that great. Way too much hiss, always have been. The EQ facilities on the surrounds of a CP65 and prior is a joke (and always was, at least the CP200 offered the option of 1/3-octave EQ). There is absolutely no point in putting in a CP65 as a DCinema processor with a D/A converter. What do you get for that effort? Three 1/3rd octave EQs and a VCA? All with a low S/N. Better hope you have noisy A/C to mask it. Furthermore, Dolby has ceased support of the CP65 and as such, it becomes a liability. Dave, the DMA8 + is about $800 less than a CP750  |  IP: Logged Victor Liorentas Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 800 From: london ontario canada Registered: May 2009 posted 12-01-2011 11:39 AM                     How about a booth keeping 2 35mm projectors but adding digital projection.Processor is a CP55 WITH CAT 441,SRA5 with cat 280t cards and a DA20. Also have D.T.S 6D. We are a single screen theater built in 1933 and have great acoustics pushed by Altec voice of the theater center and smaller Altecs for left and right. Amplifiers are Crown XLS 602.  |  IP: Logged

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