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Author Topic: Automation won't accept 2nd cue Celine Negrete Film Handler Posts: 70 From: Nevada City, CA Registered: Nov 2009 posted 05-05-2010 11:37 PM                        We just installed a Xetron Maxi 12X/PC. We have an intermission snipe at the end of our first 6k reel (our booth has no room for a platter or 2nd projector). We have the automation set up so that we place four Optitape cues in advance of the intermission snipe to mute the intermission snipe soundtrack (it is just too 'jarring'...we like the visual but we don't like the sound). The snipe is ~14 seconds long. We place three cue tapes for end of show shutdown. But, on the reel with the intermission snipe, the automation system works fine in muting the snipe but does not read the shutdown cues. On the final 6k reel (that has no intermission snipe, obviously), the shutdown cues work perfectly. In fact, I tested it today and removed the 'mute cue' for the intermission to see if it would now read the shutdown cue, and sure enough it did! Why can't I get it to read both? Is there a minimum amount of time that must pass before the automation will accept a 2nd cue set? I looked at the manual but I couldn't find any information that would help. Any help appreciated!  |  IP: Logged Chris Slycord Film God Posts: 2986 From: 퍼항시, 경상푹도, South Korea Registered: Mar 2007 posted 05-05-2010 11:51 PM                     quote: Celine Negrete Is there a minimum amount of time that must pass before the automation will accept a 2nd cue set? Most likely that's your issue. I have no idea what the minimum time between cues on your automation but most of them have some time delay to avoid the possibility of a cue wearing down and getting read as two cues instead of just one.  |  IP: Logged Celine Negrete Film Handler Posts: 70 From: Nevada City, CA Registered: Nov 2009 posted 05-06-2010 12:08 AM                        Thanks, I had a feeling that might be where this is heading...but, that is not what I wanted to hear :-( I guess I could 'play' with it. Try adding a wee bit of black at the start of the intermission snipe to see if I can get it past that minimum. But, if it requires 60 seconds, or something like that, then manual end of reel shut down it will be!  |  IP: Logged Cameron Glendinning Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 845 From: West Ryde, Sydney, NSW Australia Registered: Dec 2005 posted 05-06-2010 12:18 AM                     So when do we see the finished shots? Adding the black sounds like a good idea.  |  IP: Logged Celine Negrete Film Handler Posts: 70 From: Nevada City, CA Registered: Nov 2009 posted 05-06-2010 12:29 AM                        Hey Cameron! We have our photographer coming Friday morning so something should be up soon thereafter. Thanks for asking...It looks beautiful! And, hoping a few seconds of black will work!  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 05-06-2010 12:35 AM                     my suspicion is that the timing cam must cycle  |  IP: Logged Ian Parfrey Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1049 From: Imbil Australia 26 deg 27' 42.66" S 152 deg 42' 23.40" E Registered: Feb 2009 posted 05-06-2010 12:37 AM                     Hi Celine. What mode do you have your automation set for? e.g Random or Sequential? I'm only guessing here, but by the sound of it yours may be set to RANDOM which counts the number of foils and pulses the corresponding matrix line. Perhaps you could try going SEQUENTIAL which uses 1 foil per matrix cue point. This way, you would not only cut down on the number of foils to put on a print, but possibly free up more cue points on the matrix for your shutdown sequence. Any ideas on this, guys?  |  IP: Logged Celine Negrete Film Handler Posts: 70 From: Nevada City, CA Registered: Nov 2009 posted 05-06-2010 12:50 AM                        Hi Ian, I didn't set the automation system up, but after taking a look at the manual, I thought the 'random' and 'sequential' might come into play. Right now, with a 2 1/2 hour film needing to be on three 6ks, and two intermissions, I am using a total of seventeen pieces of foil cues! I can ask our tech tomorrow if moving to sequential might be a solution. It isn't the end of the world if we must manually shutdown the first 6k, as we have never had automation before (it was installed last week). But, I am rather liking the 'consistency' of how it works, everything starting and stopping at exactly the same time in the same manner. With five different staff members operating the booth, it makes for a more clean presentation.  |  IP: Logged Jeremy Weigel Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1062 From: Edmond, OK, USA Registered: Mar 2007 posted 05-06-2010 01:02 AM                     Sounds like you want it set up for Random not Sequential since you have 4 cues (intermission) before 3 cues for end of show.  |  IP: Logged Robert E. Allen Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1078 From: Checotah, Oklahoma Registered: Jul 2002 posted 05-06-2010 02:05 AM                     Hey Celine! If all else fails you might try putting a projectionist in the booth. Looking forward to the photos.  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 05-06-2010 02:38 AM                        Sequential should work fine. Just put the MUTE cue before the shutdown cue on every reel, even the last one. No harm in that. If it is still a timing issue even in sequential I am betting there is something somewhere that can be adjusted to get around that, though I wouldn't poke around it if you didn't know what you were doing. I really hate the Xetron Maxi 12PC automation. So many cues that must be placed in the image area and they do not peel off easily at all. They are distracting onscreen and they can damage film. Please be sure to put a piece of clear splicing tape on the film and put the cue on top on the tape.  |  IP: Logged Celine Negrete Film Handler Posts: 70 From: Nevada City, CA Registered: Nov 2009 posted 05-06-2010 11:07 AM                        Robert, a projectionist in the booth, as in someone completely dedicated to running the booth...not an option. We are a 62-seat art house with one staff member at a time working the whole shebang ;-) But, like I said earlier, not a huge deal to not be able to cue the shutdown if it came to that, as the staff member needs to be there to change reels anyhow, so they are usually in the booth at that time. I just got so excited about everything being timed perfectly that I wanted all the cues to work. Joe, I hear you regarding the placement and visibility of the cues. But, it is the piece of equipment we have to work with. I heard about using splicing tape first then the cue tape over it and I have been doing that. At least we don't use yellow splice tape for reel changes ;-) I am committed to doing everything I can that I have control over to make the presentation top notch. Will try your suggestion regarding sequential and the mute cue on every reel. Thanks!!  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 05-06-2010 12:20 PM                     deleted ..  |  IP: Logged Robert E. Allen Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1078 From: Checotah, Oklahoma Registered: Jul 2002 posted 05-06-2010 02:00 PM                     Actually Celine, I meant at shutdown time. I'd love to see your place as I am planning an 80 seat mini cinema. I used to be an I.A.operator in a number of west coast cities including Sacramento (even when I was a theatre owner). Automation, of course, has eliminated most of those jobs. Good for you for striving for top notch performances. The public WILL notice.  |  IP: Logged Celine Negrete Film Handler Posts: 70 From: Nevada City, CA Registered: Nov 2009 posted 05-06-2010 02:34 PM                        Stop by anytime you find yourself down this way, Robert! Since our booth is within 10 feet of our concession stand, which is within 10 feet of the auditorium, we can be in the booth within seconds (we can hear the projector from the concession stand when it is running). So, ultimately, manual shutdown is not a problem. But, I wanted to understand why I couldn't make it work w/automation. Thanks for the suggestions! Looking into it today.  |  IP: Logged

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