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Author Topic: Quickest way to fix a tails up reel on a platter? Mike Heenan Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1896 From: Scottsdale, AZ, USA Registered: Mar 2000 posted 11-01-2009 08:43 PM                     Last night I was helping a friend breaking down some prints at a theater, and at the same time there was an Indian movie playing in one of the auditoriums on a platter system. Reel 6 (the next to the last reel) was built up tails up and projected upside down on the screen. The guy supervising the show wasn't in the booth, so I tried to figure out ways to fix the problem. I tried to tear down the print onto a 6K reel, so that I could get reel 6 reoriented on the rewind table and then build it back up onto the platter. That didn't work because the film almost flew off the platter because of the tension from the MUT. We then decided just to pull out the remaining footage of reel 7 and just projected reel 7. The promoter was ok with this as he didn't want to keep the audience waiting that long. Has this happened to anyone before and how did you fix it?  |  IP: Logged Jeremy Weigel Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1062 From: Edmond, OK, USA Registered: Mar 2007 posted 11-01-2009 09:29 PM                     Basically you're trying to break down a print without a center ring/hub right? I've done this, but as you found out if you start to go too fast the remaining film begins to shift and get all distorted. What I usually do it is to let a little bit of a reverse wrap get started around the outside perimeter of the print as you break it down (basically get the platter spinning slightly faster than the MUT is taking it off the platter). Using one hand (let the edges of the film glide through your thumb and forefinger) to keep the film from dragging face down as it comes off the platter (usually my left and the other (right) spinning the platter slightly faster as to have almost zero tension on the film to keep it from being pulled off the platter. This is being done with the MUT set at a speed you can keep up with. You may also want to have another person there to control the speed if you begin to get tired and need to stop suddenly. Hope all that made some sense. If I had a video camera I'd make a short video for ya.  |  IP: Logged Justin Hamaker Film God Posts: 2253 From: Lakeport, CA USA Registered: Jan 2004 posted 11-01-2009 10:43 PM                        I've had several occasions where I've had to break down without a centering ring in place. The first thing to do is put a ring on the platter so the print doesn't get thrown. If you're more than 1-2 reels into the movie, use the over-sized ring if you have one. At this point I'll use the suction cup brackets we have and place them around the inside of the film. You can also use film cores that you tape to the platter. When it comes to actually winding off the print, you are pretty much going to have to spin the platter by hand and keep the speed on the MUT down. If you get any kind of pull on the print it's going to get pulled off center and compound the problem.  |  IP: Logged John Wilson Film God Posts: 5438 From: Sydney, Australia. Registered: Dec 1999 posted 11-01-2009 11:24 PM                     Not sure either of you guys read the topic which is... Quickest way to fix a tails up reel on a platter? Separate the reel from the rest of the print so you have a large 20 minute(ish) section. Flip it inside out so the outside film becomes the inside film. Re-attach it to the print. Go.  |  IP: Logged Jeremy Weigel Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1062 From: Edmond, OK, USA Registered: Mar 2007 posted 11-01-2009 11:50 PM                     Never thought of that. Learn something new every day.  |  IP: Logged Jarret Chessell Master Film Handler Posts: 288 From: London, Ontario, Canada Registered: Jan 2009 posted 11-01-2009 11:59 PM                     I have a great technique... when i'm assembling the print, i pay attention.  |  IP: Logged Justin Hamaker Film God Posts: 2253 From: Lakeport, CA USA Registered: Jan 2004 posted 11-02-2009 12:15 AM                        John, I never thought of that. I'll have to keep it in mind should I ever encounter the problem.  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 11-02-2009 01:59 AM                     The proper way is to let the film run all the way through the projector, then break down the last reels until you get to the offending reel. This way you don't cause any damage to the print (which doesn't help you when the print isn't pre-screened though). Also rather than break a print down without a center ring, it is smarter to "speed wind" it through the brain. This way you only need to stand beside the platter to adjust the MUT's speed control to make sure you aren't pulling it through the brain faster than the platter can feed it.  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 11-02-2009 02:53 AM                     quote: John Wilson Flip it inside out so the outside film becomes the inside film. Re-attach it to the print. Go. Course, when you do the inside out trick, wouldn't the wind be a bit contorted due to the curve of the film itself? In any form. just have to be careful on this trick.. -monte  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 11-02-2009 04:18 AM                        I had this happen once, and ONLY once on Star Trek Generations. I caught it when I screened the movie. I let the reel run through, wound it back down onto a 2K reel, rewound it, loaded it up to the take-up deck, reattached incoming reel, the end.  |  IP: Logged Scott D. Neff Theatre Dork Posts: 919 From: San Francisco, CA Registered: Oct 1999 posted 11-02-2009 11:00 AM                        I had this happen a couple of times during employee screenings back in the day. During particularly popular or long ones that didn't start until the wee hours I would flip the film inside out otherwise I would speed it through the platter, tear it down, rewind and then rebuild it. I think though if you do turn the film inside out that the feed starts coming from the opposite direction and the platter won't spin right. I could be mistaken but I do remember there being an actual technical problem with flipping the film. But it's been years... *sigh*  |  IP: Logged Mike Blakesley Film God Posts: 12767 From: Forsyth, Montana Registered: Jun 99 posted 11-02-2009 11:15 AM                        Maybe it's because it's Monday morning and I'm not awake yet, but what do you guys mean "flip the film?" If it's on the platter, seems like if you flip it over, the only thing you'd have would be the soundtrack down instead of up, and the wind would be backwards...but the tail would still be on the outside. So how does "flipping the film" solve the tails-up problem?  |  IP: Logged Jack Ondracek Film God Posts: 2348 From: Port Orchard, WA, USA Registered: Oct 2002 posted 11-02-2009 11:39 AM                        It's got to be a sick joke. There's no way you can take the inside diameter of the wind and convince it to be larger, merely by flipping it. More likely, the first time you try it and find your booth full of spaghetti, you'll come back here with warm fuzzy thoughts and kind words... mainly because you've just turned a 10 minute fix into a 2-hour cluster.  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 11-02-2009 11:53 AM                     Cut the film. Wind the end of the film up onto the takeup deck. Speed wind the print through the brain till you get to the end of the reel. Take the reel from the MUT and wind it onto a trailer reel. Yes, it will be larger than the trailer reel can hold but just be careful. If you can handle prints on cores, this shouldn't be a problem for you. Break down the rest of the reel from the takeup deck onto another reel. Splice it onto the film on the trailer reel and wind it up. If you have some threading leader handy, add an appropriate amount to the reel to help you thread up. Treat this trailer reel full of film just like you would any other trailer pack. Drop it in, splice the film together in the appropriate places, thread it up and you should be ready to go. (Don't forget to remove your threading leader if you used any!) Had to do this a couple of times. It takes about 15 minutes if you are careful.  |  IP: Logged Phil Ranucci Expert Film Handler Posts: 236 From: Carpinteria,CA, United States Registered: May 2006 posted 11-02-2009 11:55 AM                     Separate the tails out reel from the rest of the movie. Pick up the tails out section. You flip the backwards section inside out so the head is in the center and the tail is on the outside.Drop it on the platter and start back up.  |  IP: Logged

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