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» Film-Tech Forum   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » How do I get my long shaft out of this hole? (Page 1)

 
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Author Topic: How do I get my long shaft out of this hole?
Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 09-01-2008 07:35 PM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I have a Neumade PRT Ultra work bench which was designed in The Land Without Common Sense back in the 1400's or so. I have a spindle where the key for common shipping reels has long since worn off.

See?
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I need to get the shaft out and replace it with this new one I found:
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But there doesn't seem to be any screws that allow this. There are only these weird, tiny holes with what appears to be some sort of pegs or things in them:
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One goes through the shaft to the other side, and the other simply locks down and provides pressure on the outside of the shaft.

They aren't screws. How do I loosen them and/or get them out, and then how do I get them back in once the shaft is replaced? I imagine I'll probably have to travel back in time to before color was invented to procure the proper tool. Maybe one of the tools is a hammer?

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John Wilson
Film God

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From: Sydney, Australia.
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 09-01-2008 07:44 PM      Profile for John Wilson   Email John Wilson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
You'll have to hammer the one that goes though out. The other one could be drilled out but what to put back in its place? Does the new one have the hole in it for when you want to put it back in?

This could take a while. Is the old shaft badly bent or is it just missing the key? It may be more trouble than it's worth.

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Jack Ondracek
Film God

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From: Port Orchard, WA, USA
Registered: Oct 2002


 - posted 09-01-2008 07:47 PM      Profile for Jack Ondracek   Author's Homepage   Email Jack Ondracek   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I think they're called expansion pins. The one that goes all the way through, you can punch out with something of the same diameter, at least far enough that you can get some pliers around it.

The other one, you'll probably have to drill out. Hopefully, the pin is softer than the metal around it.

You can buy replacements at Home Depot, & some hardware stores with decent fastener sections.

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Jon P. Inghram
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 124
From: Wichita, KS USA
Registered: Jan 2007


 - posted 09-01-2008 08:00 PM      Profile for Jon P. Inghram   Email Jon P. Inghram   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
If the part isn't actually bent and/or broken, why not just get some new keys? If you don't know where to get them (doing a quick Google search didn't come up with any info) I can ask our tech where he gets 'em, we have the same type of icky workbench and, before I found the shaft with the adjustable pin that fitted both the shipping reels and our 6k reels, we used to chew up those puny keys.

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Jeremy Weigel
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1062
From: Edmond, OK, USA
Registered: Mar 2007


 - posted 09-01-2008 08:02 PM      Profile for Jeremy Weigel   Email Jeremy Weigel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
They're roll pins. You can either tap them out with an object slightly less in diameter or drill them out (which I usually do when they're that small). You can buy replacements at just about any hardware store.

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Robert Minichino
Master Film Handler

Posts: 350
From: Haskell, NJ, USA
Registered: Dec 2005


 - posted 09-01-2008 08:11 PM      Profile for Robert Minichino   Author's Homepage   Email Robert Minichino   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Those pins are called spring pins, roll pins or split pins (the latter also refers to cotter pins), they're friction fit into the holes (they're springy so they stay in) and they're driven out with a pin punch and a mallet (or hammer [Big Grin] ).

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Monte L Fullmer
Film God

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From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
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 - posted 09-01-2008 08:48 PM      Profile for Monte L Fullmer   Email Monte L Fullmer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
(OR, you could take out the key from the new one and put it in the old one ....be a bit easier... )

.. and find a supplier that still has those keys in stock for the PRT ULTRA...

Or, if you want to do it the hard way, get a good bench vise and a drill bit as a punch to press those spring pins out.

-Monte

[ 09-01-2008, 11:59 PM: Message edited by: Monte L Fullmer ]

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Don Furr
Master Film Handler

Posts: 499
From: Sun City, Ca USA
Registered: Nov 2002


 - posted 09-01-2008 08:48 PM      Profile for Don Furr   Email Don Furr   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Joe I've got the same bench here at the house and got tired of breaking the pins so I now use the adjustable drive pin spindle. It fits cores, and all house reels and won't break. Throw that crap in the trash.

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Louis Bornwasser
Film God

Posts: 4435
From: prospect ky usa
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 - posted 09-01-2008 09:11 PM      Profile for Louis Bornwasser   Author's Homepage   Email Louis Bornwasser   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Push out the one that goes all the way through. Using a vice, twist off the shaft, which will shear off the short pin.

Then push the short pin inward, shear it off with a punch, repeat until it is gone. Reassemble. Louis

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David Stambaugh
Film God

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From: Eugene, Oregon
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 - posted 09-01-2008 09:14 PM      Profile for David Stambaugh   Author's Homepage   Email David Stambaugh   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
What Robert said. My experience with roll pins is on foosball tables where they're used to fasten the plastic "players" to the steel rods. The pins eventually shear off. Best way I found to get them out is pin punch (of the proper size) and a hard mallet or a hammer.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 09-01-2008 09:31 PM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I need to have the key for my expandable trailer flange. The key on the new one does not look like it can be removed, and the old one has a worn space that does not look like it can be replaced. If you put something in there, it would just fall out via gravity. Yes, the new shaft has a hole in it for the pin to go through.

I don't understand why something like this even exists. The Kelmar table doesn't have spindles where keys break all the time. Who thought designing it this way would be a good idea?

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John Walsh
Film God

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From: Connecticut, USA, Earth, Milky Way
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 - posted 09-01-2008 09:32 PM      Profile for John Walsh   Email John Walsh   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Wow, a spindle from the 1400's! Must be pretty good to last longer then some glaciers! Those keys do break, but it is often because of, er, uhm, rough use; using 6000ft reels with the 5/16 spindle, turning on the rewind table with the speed control on full, etc. Replace the spindle like everyone said. The pin is a 5/32 spring pin. The key is pressed in; don't just try to put a new key in 'cause it will only fall out. Replace the entire A-1597 shaft.

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Jon P. Inghram
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 124
From: Wichita, KS USA
Registered: Jan 2007


 - posted 09-01-2008 10:08 PM      Profile for Jon P. Inghram   Email Jon P. Inghram   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Blu tack stuffed into the slot keeps the key from falling out.

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Phil Ranucci
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 229
From: Carpinteria,CA, United States
Registered: May 2006


 - posted 09-01-2008 10:35 PM      Profile for Phil Ranucci   Email Phil Ranucci   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
If you have the R-9 key just knock out the old one and press the new one in in a vise. I've done it and it will stay if you press it hard enough. Otherwise you'll have to drive out the roll pin and replace the whole shaft.

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Monte L Fullmer
Film God

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From: Nampa, Idaho, USA
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 - posted 09-02-2008 12:05 AM      Profile for Monte L Fullmer   Email Monte L Fullmer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Phil Ranucci
I've done it and it will stay if you press it hard enough..

I used to do the same thing with a vise. But, did an additional trick was to drill the opposite end of the shaft with a large bit to create a countersink to when I pressed in that key, the tab would be exposed enough to where I would flare that end of the tab in that countersink that I created.

That key didn't go anywhere...and I had a good dozen of those R-9 keys on hand.

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