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» Film-Tech Forum   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » Kelmer cleaner, Film-Guard, and a black scratch

   
Author Topic: Kelmer cleaner, Film-Guard, and a black scratch
Justin Hamaker
Film God

Posts: 2044
From: Lakeport, CA USA
Registered: Jan 2004


 - posted 08-13-2008 05:57 PM      Profile for Justin Hamaker   Author's Homepage   Email Justin Hamaker   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Yesterday I discovered a black scratch in our print of Swing Vote. It was a perfectly vertical scratch (running from the top of the screen to the bottom - I guess that might actually be a horizontal scratch). As best I can tell, the scratch resulted when one of the outside brain rollers on the AW3 platter somehow was halfway up the shaft so that the rim of the center roller was riding on the middle of the outer roller.
 -
Before discovering the scratch, I discovered the roller had lost it's E ring, but I can only assume the reason the roller was halfway up the shaft was because the person who threaded didn't ensure it was seated properly - whether the roller moved during the show or was that way from the beginning, I can not say.

Anyway, the show after the scratch was discovered, I ran the Kelmar cleaner with a fresh roll of media saturated with Film-Guard - in fact we did this for the next 2 shows. Later in the day I checked the film and the black scratch was no longer visible. I had read on Film-Tech that this was possible, but this is the first time I had seen a black scratch removed (or at least masked) by using Film-Guard.

[ 08-14-2008, 04:35 AM: Message edited by: Justin Hamaker ]

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John Wilson
Film God

Posts: 5435
From: Sydney, Australia.
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 08-13-2008 06:35 PM      Profile for John Wilson   Email John Wilson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
A little while ago we received a print on a move over from one of the major chains in town. This thing I kid you not had at least 15 scratches on it running from top to tail of the print.

It took about 3 days to have them all with the exception of one very deep base scratch...completely gone. Even the deep one was barely visible.

Oh yes...Filmguard is good. [thumbsup]

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Chris Nolan
Film Handler

Posts: 16
From: Fairfax, Va, USA
Registered: Jun 2008


 - posted 08-13-2008 10:12 PM      Profile for Chris Nolan   Email Chris Nolan   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I can top that, John! We had a print of Horton Hears a Who come to us on move over from a big 14-plex. There was only one scratch, but it was a huge green scratch right down the middle of the screen.

I don't know if Filmguard can help in that regard, as that was before I learned how to use the Kelmar, and we just opted to order a new print anyway.

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John Wilson
Film God

Posts: 5435
From: Sydney, Australia.
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 08-13-2008 10:32 PM      Profile for John Wilson   Email John Wilson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Well, it may be a great product...but it can't replace emulsion image from a green scratch.

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Chris Nolan
Film Handler

Posts: 16
From: Fairfax, Va, USA
Registered: Jun 2008


 - posted 08-13-2008 10:36 PM      Profile for Chris Nolan   Email Chris Nolan   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Yeah, I figured it probably couldn't... maybe one day...

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 08-13-2008 11:46 PM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Maybe never. Unless you went in and Photoshopped each frame, there would be no way to reconstruct the missing image whereas a base-side scratch is usually just a groove filled with dirt.

quote: Justin Hitmaker
It was a perfectly vertical scratch (running from the top of the screen to the bottom - I guess that might actually be a horizontal scratch).
WTF?????

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Justin Hamaker
Film God

Posts: 2044
From: Lakeport, CA USA
Registered: Jan 2004


 - posted 08-14-2008 12:06 AM      Profile for Justin Hamaker   Author's Homepage   Email Justin Hamaker   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
In reading Film-Tech, I have heard the different types of scratches describe by their orientation on the film stock rather than the screen. I have understood it to mean that a scratch that runs along the length of the film is described as a horizontal scratch rather than vertical as it appears on screen.

This caused me some major confusion when I was reading a thread about horizontal scratches caused by the take-up arm on an AW3 platter and I could not see how that would be possible.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 08-14-2008 12:24 AM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Scratches should be called by the way they appear on the screen. Anyone who doesn't do that is being perhaps a bit too pretentious.

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Justin Hamaker
Film God

Posts: 2044
From: Lakeport, CA USA
Registered: Jan 2004


 - posted 08-14-2008 12:29 AM      Profile for Justin Hamaker   Author's Homepage   Email Justin Hamaker   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
You'll get absolutely no objection from me on that one.

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John Hawkinson
Film God

Posts: 2273
From: Cambridge, MA, USA
Registered: Feb 2002


 - posted 08-14-2008 04:14 PM      Profile for John Hawkinson   Author's Homepage   Email John Hawkinson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
While there may be some confusion between whether vertically means "vertically on the projected image" or "vertically on the film as it runs through the projector," it never means "vertically for the orientation that the film is using on the transport device." Since the first two are the same for 35mm 4-perf film, everything is crystal clear and unambiguous unless you decide to try VistaVision or IMAX.

(It would be the height of foolishness if the platter projectionists and the changeover projectionists described the same scratch using opposite terms!)

--jhawk

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 08-14-2008 05:18 PM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I agree, who says a film's natural state is horizontal (for those who would argue otherwise)?

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Bruce Hansen
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 847
From: Stone Mountain, GA, USA
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 08-15-2008 06:08 PM      Profile for Bruce Hansen   Email Bruce Hansen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
My natural state is horizontal. [sleep]

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