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» Film-Tech Forum   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » Converting Kinoton FP-20 RSSD to DP-70

   
Author Topic: Converting Kinoton FP-20 RSSD to DP-70
Robert Minichino
Master Film Handler

Posts: 350
From: Haskell, NJ, USA
Registered: Dec 2005


 - posted 07-28-2008 12:20 PM      Profile for Robert Minichino   Author's Homepage   Email Robert Minichino   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
We have a pair of the Kinoton RSSD reverse-scan sound readers for the FP-20 style projectors, and I'd rather have them on our DP-70s, but they don't fit. [Smile]

Looking at photos it seems the only obvious difference between the Kinoton DP-70 reader and the FP-20 reader is the machined base. If this is the case then switching the rest of the hardware around should be trivial.

Does anyone know if this is possible and if Kinoton (or anyone else) sells just the base for the DP-70? If they don't sell it, I suppose it wouldn't be too difficult to make one.

If not I'll just do the BACP conversion on the DP-70s and get a Dolby or BACP penthouse for SR-D. It'd just be a shame to have these sitting around on the spare projectors.

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Steve Guttag
We forgot the crackers Gromit!!!

Posts: 11996
From: Annapolis, MD
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 07-28-2008 02:22 PM      Profile for Steve Guttag   Email Steve Guttag   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It isn't just the base but that is certainly part of it. It is actually an Upside-Down reader. The flywheel is also different on the DP70 version. The DP70 version has an extra damper arm as well.

In fact, the story goes that Kinoton was shamed into making the DP70 reader after someone else took a conventional reader and flipped it upside down and made it fit the DP70.

DP70 reader:

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FP20/30 reader:

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Robert Minichino
Master Film Handler

Posts: 350
From: Haskell, NJ, USA
Registered: Dec 2005


 - posted 07-28-2008 02:59 PM      Profile for Robert Minichino   Author's Homepage   Email Robert Minichino   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I believe it; I've seen a photo of a prototype DP-70 reader that looks exactly like an upside-down FP reader on a mounting plate with the bottom-right corner missing. I might just try this on my own. Now where did I put that bandsaw....

BTW, I don't see another damper arm on the production unit photo.

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Steve Guttag
We forgot the crackers Gromit!!!

Posts: 11996
From: Annapolis, MD
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 07-28-2008 03:30 PM      Profile for Steve Guttag   Email Steve Guttag   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The little roller just below the drum is on a damped arm. Then again, they might have changed it since I put one in.

Steve

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Robert Minichino
Master Film Handler

Posts: 350
From: Haskell, NJ, USA
Registered: Dec 2005


 - posted 07-28-2008 04:36 PM      Profile for Robert Minichino   Author's Homepage   Email Robert Minichino   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
That's interesting. I think I'll live dangerously and give it a go anyway. I should be able to reverse any modifications I make if I want to use it for the FP-20s again.

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Gerard Bierling
Film Handler

Posts: 9
From: Roden The Netherlands
Registered: Jul 2008


 - posted 07-31-2008 07:13 AM      Profile for Gerard Bierling   Email Gerard Bierling   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello all
I am new to this forum but I have visited it for many years.
I have been a cinematech for The Wolff Cinema Group in Utrecht, The Netherlands and retired since 1-1-2000
This thread brought me to register to be able to show you some pictures of the FP 20/30 reverse-scan for the DP 70.
I made 5 of them in 1999.
You can see, it is hardly impossible to use them again on a FP 20/30

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Greetings,

Gerard

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Robert Minichino
Master Film Handler

Posts: 350
From: Haskell, NJ, USA
Registered: Dec 2005


 - posted 07-31-2008 08:24 AM      Profile for Robert Minichino   Author's Homepage   Email Robert Minichino   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Wow, that's very helpful. Thank you for posting those pictures. [beer]

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Tim Asten
Film Handler

Posts: 98
From: Brighton, United Kingdom
Registered: Nov 2006


 - posted 07-31-2008 05:57 PM      Profile for Tim Asten   Email Tim Asten   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Nice pics. I was watching a video on You Tube of an FP20 with what looked like the original analogue sound reader with some differences - although it was hard to tell as the video was a bit blurry.(Search for 'Virgin Liverpool' on You Tube). The narrator said it was Dolby Digital but non reverse scan. The only Kinotons I've worked on are the FP40's, so my knowledge of the FP20 is limited, but I wasn't aware that Kinoton made a SR-D reader other than the reverse scan one [Confused]

Tim.

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Robert Minichino
Master Film Handler

Posts: 350
From: Haskell, NJ, USA
Registered: Dec 2005


 - posted 07-31-2008 06:15 PM      Profile for Robert Minichino   Author's Homepage   Email Robert Minichino   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi, Tim. I haven't seen anything like that FP-20 reader in that video; it looks like the old incandescent reader with the SR-D CCD assembly tacked on above the exciter lamp housing.

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Stephen Furley
Film God

Posts: 3045
From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England
Registered: May 2002


 - posted 08-01-2008 01:39 AM      Profile for Stephen Furley   Email Stephen Furley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
I wasn't aware that Kinoton made a SR-D reader other than the reverse scan one [Confused]

I've never seen such a thing, but they do make an analogue red light conversion for the original sound head; there's a pdf of it here

Maybe it was one o these, and the narrator was simply incorrect about it being digital.

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Max Biela
Film Handler

Posts: 89
From: Dortmund, Germany
Registered: Sep 2003


 - posted 08-01-2008 02:29 AM      Profile for Max Biela   Email Max Biela   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
No, that is the original Kinoton SR*D add-on which was mounted on the top of the regular FP20/FP30 soundhead. Parts were the same as in the Cat 700 (no LEDs!).

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John Wilson
Film God

Posts: 5435
From: Sydney, Australia.
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 08-01-2008 03:11 AM      Profile for John Wilson   Email John Wilson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Gerald

Thanks for the pics...well done and welcome to Film-Tech. Please post again soon.

John

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Emiel De Jong
Film Handler

Posts: 25
From: Geldrop The Netherlands
Registered: Mar 2007


 - posted 08-05-2008 01:22 AM      Profile for Emiel De Jong   Email Emiel De Jong   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
One of those 5 DP70's in action:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_J79i3OR-8

It's a relatively long video, but it was a historical moment for us [Smile] . We plan to have this one ready later this summer for a backgarden show of Krakatoa...

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Ben Wales
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 602
From: Southampton. England
Registered: Jul 99


 - posted 08-05-2008 04:54 PM      Profile for Ben Wales   Email Ben Wales   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Emiel De Jong
It's a relatively long video, but it was a historical moment for us . We plan to have this one ready later this summer for a backgarden show of Krakatoa...
Well done on that, what sound sysyem are you going to use and have you sent the DP70 serial number to the in70mm.com DP70 Projector Database?.

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Ton Beetz
Film Handler

Posts: 2
From: Geldrop, Noordbrabant, Netherlands
Registered: Jul 2006


 - posted 08-06-2008 06:46 AM      Profile for Ton Beetz   Email Ton Beetz   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hello Ben,

Actually Emiel and me each have one DP70 from MIDI, Tilburg in the Netherlands.
They have ser. nr. 1657 and 1658. The theatre closed december 2007.
On Youtube you can see 1657 but both are identical. The soundhead is great.
We are installing a CP200 but a Philips OMA 4 is also a possibility.
There are 6 DP70s in Geldrop.
Six weeks ago I mailed Thomas Hauerslev with pictures and all; I got a very short answer but nothing has happened on the serial nrs. overview yet.

Kind regards,
Ton Beetz

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