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Author Topic: Zeiss Ikon Favorit 16 - info required Matthew Taylor Expert Film Handler Posts: 186 From: Essex, UK Registered: Mar 2004 posted 02-11-2007 02:11 PM                     Could anyone point me to some photos of the Zeiss Ikon Favorit 16 projector. If there is a manual available for download somewhere too, that would be helpful. Thanks.  |  IP: Logged Kenneth Wuepper Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1026 From: Saginaw, MI, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 02-11-2007 08:40 PM                     Matthew, Check in the photos section for the Temple Theatre, Saginaw photos. There is a Zeis 16B pictured in our booth. I have all three manuals, Xenon lamp, sound amplifier and the projector manual. They are in German language I think but then I might be wrong. It's been a few years since I had to look into them. Brad, How can we get these manuals on the site? They came to use directly from Zeis in Germany. I don't have a way to scan the larger pages. We would not let them out of our posession either. KEN  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 02-12-2007 08:50 AM                     The favorite line is actual rebadged Prevost equipment One thing that does vary depending on vintage is the holdback roller is a sprocket on some others it is a rubber roller and the diameter of the sound drum is different  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 02-12-2007 09:49 AM                        It looks just like the Prevost P16--my least favorite (no pun intended) projector of all time. Has anyone figured out what that tension adjustment on the sprocket just before the sound drum is supposed to do?  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 02-12-2007 10:22 AM                     It sets the amount of damping effect on the sound drum it is balanced against the fricton of the felt clutch in the pinch roller above the sound drum  |  IP: Logged Richard Fowler Film God Posts: 2392 From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA Registered: Jun 2001 posted 02-12-2007 10:37 AM                     The clutch roller before the sound drum is to give some back tension to the film....also found on other projectors such as the 16mm Bauer Selecton.  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 02-12-2007 10:46 AM                        Hmm...I know of one of these machines that has some sort of "issues" with that tension adjustment and will occasionally go into full-on film-shredding mode, usually right at the beginning of a show (or, sometimes, at the end of a reel). There is some relationship to this tension adjustment being off. Any ideas? What happens is that the loop right after the intermittent is lost and the film breaks right there. It seems to happen about one out of every fifty (?) shows. This place always runs large reels and an additional complication is that the machine has an E-TRAC inverter installed for slow startup and also to allow running at silent speed.  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 02-12-2007 11:54 AM                     Ithink it may be a takeup issue if the film is pulled off the holdback sprocket it will then loose the stabalizer loop  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 02-12-2007 04:46 PM                     I know Prevost on their P-16 used a real crappy brake-roller design like that...it could easily self-tension itself into full film shredding mode.  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 02-13-2007 09:47 AM                        Exactly; this happens on a P16. And the fix for this is what, exactly? It may be a takeup issue, though I always make a point of using floating-hub reels and giving the reel a bit of a manual push at startup (to avoid bouncing due to the slow start provided by the E-TRAC). Could it just need a takeup tension adjustment? The film isn't being ripped across the holdback sprocket or anything like that and I don't think that the sprocket itself is loose in the shaft (will have to check). The other issue that I've had with this machine is that the trap seems to be a dirt magnet, and no amount of dust-off seems to be able to help get rid of hairballs mid-show. Is there even a parts supplier for these machines in the US? In fairness, I should point out that the picture is pretty steady and there is no "dirt-embedder" roller like on the intermittent-movement Eikis (e.g. EX-6120). If anyone wants to donate an FP-38E to a nonprofit educational institution, I doubt that they would refuse....  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 02-13-2007 04:46 PM                     I have no qualms about stating that the Prevost P16 is a complete piece of junk. Any goodness in it is by pure accident. I also have no doubt that someone on here will tout how nice they are but they are just plain wrong! As to the brake roller...there is little to do about it...It has been awhile but one could possibly goop the treads so the tension set nut will tend to stay put when set. As to the "E-trac"...I don't recall any E-tracks on the ones I operated...however E-tracs are normally fully programmable so any ramp up/down speed should be able to be set for precise starts/stops. I do like TB Woods inverters (E-trac and other drives).  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 02-13-2007 04:54 PM                     Gosh, Steve and I actually completely agree on something. For 16mm give me a nice Eastman 25 any day over anything else made!! Mark  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 02-13-2007 06:18 PM                     That and phase control Potts/Strong platters are for the birds. For 16mm...I like the Kinoton FP38E best of all Scarecrow. Best sound, best picture. The Eastman was certainly best of its day and it holds up pretty darn well.  |  IP: Logged Richard Fowler Film God Posts: 2392 From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA Registered: Jun 2001 posted 02-13-2007 06:51 PM                     I used to service quite a few of the Prevost / Zeiss units. Xetron ( and probably Neumade at present ) have or had the parts. Most service problems where the sound drag roller, someone playing with the sound optics ( a real pain to restore with sound focus film ) or the wimpy take up motor on the Xetron designed units that where designed to "stall" but mostly burned up in short order and were replaced with a decent torque motor.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 02-13-2007 07:38 PM                     quote: Steve Guttag For 16mm...I like the Kinoton FP38E best of all Scarecrow. Best sound, best picture. The Eastman was certainly best of its day and it holds up pretty darn well. Well I just so happened to have the chance to compare both of them in the not too distant past and the Eastman VERY DEFINATELY blew the Kinoton out of the water, especially in screen brightness and sound playback, as well as its ability to project acceptably warped, shrunken film. At the latter it excelled over the Kinoton which actually spit some of the film right out... The Eastman was not quite as good in steadiness but was way within SMPTE specs. In fact the Film Department head that looked at and demoed both projectors and ultimately purchased the Eastman said it was hands down in the Eastmans favor. The Kinoton was certainly the runner up and the machine that I orginally wanted to install there. Keep in mind that this was no "stock" Eastman and has a number of mods done to it. This version of the Eastman is now installed in close to 20 locations... in many museums and screening rooms across the states. The end cost is about the same as the Kinoton. Given the fact that new Eastman 25's cost 5k without lamp back in the early 60's that Eastman today would cost close to 60k!! Mark  |  IP: Logged

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