my profile | my password | search | faq & rules | forum home

» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » Simplex PR1050 intermittent shoe alignment

Author Topic: Simplex PR1050 intermittent shoe alignment Eric Robinson Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 538 From: Santa Rosa, CA Registered: Jan 2005 posted 04-12-2006 09:13 PM                     I have a Simplex 1050 which seems to have a shoe alignment issue. I have adjusted the gate closure so that the shoe just seats on the intermittent sprocket; however, when looking at the shoe in the seated position, the lower end of the shoe has a slight space while the upper portion of the shoe is snug in the sprocket. This is a curved gate with the shoe attached. At the bottom of the gate there is a tab that the intermittent shoe assembly screws to. Should I perhaps try bending this tab a bit to make the angle of the shoe mesh more completely with the sprocket?  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 04-12-2006 09:27 PM                     What is happening is that the gate isn't closing completely to the trap. Take the gate off and on the inboard side of the trap, is a stop allen screw, right below the aperture plate area. Take a allen wrench and turn in this screw slightly. You probably will have to take off the trap from the mainframe in doing this adjustment. This will be a bit of a time consuming procedure to make the alignment correct. What the correct setting is to where the shoe JUST begins to press fully on the sprocket, with no film loaded, with the gate completely closed. DON't BEND ANYTHING....bad news on Simplexes... -Monte  |  IP: Logged Darryl Spicer Film God Posts: 3250 From: Lexington, KY, USA Registered: Dec 2000 posted 04-12-2006 10:29 PM                    check and make sure that the screw that holds the shoe onto the gate is not loose. There is a tension spring type piece on that shoe assembly that can get a bit weak and not hold the shoe completely up against the sprocket. Run a test loop to verify picture steadiness. Look at the shoe while film is in the gate. You may find it looks perfectly normal.  |  IP: Logged Eric Robinson Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 538 From: Santa Rosa, CA Registered: Jan 2005 posted 04-13-2006 12:18 AM                     I'll be working with that projector next week. I'll try removing the shoe spring and giving it a little bend for added pressure. I'll also try adjusting the gate closed a little if needed to get full contact. With regards to gate closure I encountered a projector one time where the gate adjustment screw had moved allowing the gate to shut very tightly. This machine had a lot of metal shavings on the floor below. I looked at the sprocket and the shoes but could not find the source of the metal shavings. Could these shavings perhaps come from the shoes?  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 04-13-2006 03:30 AM                     quote: Eric Robinson Could these shavings perhaps come from the shoes? ....grinding on the flat surfaces of the sprockets with no film loaded in the machine...metal to metal...NASTY! With that stop allen threaded in and the gate closing more tighter than it needs to be, the shoes on the INT sprocket are rubbing very tightly against the sprocket.... I bet that your INT sprockets needs to be changed out. Check this area over on your next week's visit. -Monte  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 04-13-2006 05:46 AM                        Left undone that "bad sprocket" has been known to cut film. Louis  |  IP: Logged Dave Macaulay Film God Posts: 2321 From: Toronto, Canada Registered: Apr 2001 posted 04-13-2006 10:12 AM                     "Don't bend anything" is a pretty good rule, especially if you aren't sure of what you're doing. But... bending that bracket is the only way to adjust the sprocket shoe once the gate position is set correctly. I have to bend them on just about every machine I set up. Strong doesn't seem to have a procedure to set them up consistently and leaves the sprocket shoe way too tight on most new machines, and besides abrading the film this destroys the intermittent sprocket in short order if the machine is run with no film and the gate closed. The shoe should just touch the intermittent sprocket with the shoe curvature matching the sprocket diameter.  |  IP: Logged Eric Robinson Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 538 From: Santa Rosa, CA Registered: Jan 2005 posted 04-14-2006 10:46 AM                     This veers from the topic a bit, but I just learned an important detail about the intermittent sprocket alignment with the shoes. When installing a new or rebuilt intermittent, the intermittent sprocket may not be laterally aligned to mesh with the sprocket shoes. The installer of the intermittent should loosen the intermittent sprocket set screw and align the sprocket so that it is centered in the shoes so that it does not rub the sprocket teeth on any of the shoe surfaces. I have installed an intermittent in the past which I think must have had the sprocket slightly off to one side (for my projector) because this projector ended up being very loud and produced metal shavings on the floor which are likely from the shoes...and the sprocket teeth are now very sharp. I learn something new every day.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 04-14-2006 11:43 AM                     quote: Eric Robinson When installing a new or rebuilt intermittent, the intermittent sprocket may not be laterally aligned to mesh with the sprocket shoes. The installer of the intermittent should loosen the intermittent sprocket set screw and align the sprocket so that it is centered in the shoes so that it does not rub the sprocket teeth on any of the shoe surfaces. That statement is not entirely true... When installing a new movement or movement sprocket loosen the sprocket screw and using a PRECISION straight edge align the new intermittent sprocket's edge to the lower feed sprocket's edge. This way all the center lines of all the sprockets will be operating in exactly the same verticle plane. Then a slight shoe alignment to the sprocket may be in order. If things don't align correctly after setting the intermittent sprocket to its correct C/L then other gate/shoe related problems may exist.... such as a dropped gate . Remember many of the Simplex's parts are made from nothing more than pot metal and this metal is quite soft! There is also a standard spec for the height of the feed sprockets when the bushings are installed in the castings. If you ever replace those upper or lower bushings check back here before doing so!!! If you run into a 1060 with that crappy swing up gate there are two options. The 1060 has a very sloppy and inconsistant pot metal bushing that the gate pivots in to swing open. 1. (expensive fix) Obtain a new tighter tolerance bushing from Wolk or.... 2. (Sort of expensive fix) Switch over to a regular tooth sprocket(non VKF and still available from LaVezzi) so that the side play slop at the lower end of the gate won't interfer with the sprocket teeth. Also be sure the intermittent pad mounting block that screws to the curved tang is not distorted causing the pad assy to bind. The sprocket pad assy. HAS TO FLOAT on all X-L's! Mark  |  IP: Logged Sean R. Custer Film Handler Posts: 35 From: San Francisco, CA, USA Registered: Dec 2005 posted 04-14-2006 05:08 PM                        Cheers on the 1050. Before setting that intermittent sprocket shoe clearance, may as well make sure there wasn't some previous molestation of the metal. If the shoe's been out of alignment for an appreciable time, it may still be hanging in there but could be so worn as to droop at the bottom. It could have carved a tiny notch for itself on the flange on the trap, and when you tighten it that's where it wants to fasten. This will happen where people will find it loose, overtightnen, and repeat. Finally some weirdo will decide it will work better inverted. If in doubt, replace the inner and outer flanges on the shoe. Especially if there's bright metal, usually from what I've seen on the inboard flanges. Also check the leaf spring tension. When correct there's appreciable slop on that set screw in every direction except inwards/outwards from center, but only against spring tension. This is one of those parts that likes to work right, but won't neccesarily let you know when it's wrong. Until it's REALLY wrong. have a blast. -SRC  |  IP: Logged Eric Robinson Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 538 From: Santa Rosa, CA Registered: Jan 2005 posted 04-18-2006 07:48 PM                     I just noticed today, a projector which seemed to generate a lot of film noise at the intermittent. After the show was over I checked it out and indeed the shoes seemed to be rubbing on the sprocket teeth. I checked the shoes (attached to the gate) and noted shiny areas. I checked the sprocket and noted groves in the faces of the teeth. The teeth probably catch on the film everytime it advances. Another thing I noticed though is that the shoe assembly can be moved left and right about 1/16". Is this normal? If so, how do you know if the shoe is ever in the correct place?  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 04-18-2006 10:29 PM                     Its not if the shoe is in the correct lace its actually if the sprockets in the correct place..... If the sprocket IS in the correct place and the shoe is not then there is a gate or shoe tang problem. Mark  |  IP: Logged Eric Robinson Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 538 From: Santa Rosa, CA Registered: Jan 2005 posted 04-18-2006 10:38 PM                     I am trying to adjust the position of the intermittent sprocket so that it is shifted a bit towards the outboard to eliminate a shoe alignment problem. The problem I have is that the sprocket seems to be bound to the shaft. I have removed the screw and nut. So, what technique can I use to move a stubborn sprocket back and forth on the shaft without damaging the intermittent movement? [ 08-05-2006, 01:47 PM: Message edited by: Eric Robinson ]  |  IP: Logged

All times are Central (GMT -6:00)

Printer-friendly view of this topic

Hop To: Select a Forum: Category: Operations -------------------- Digital Cinema Forum Film Handlers' Forum Large Format Forum Ground Level Feature Info, Trailer Attachments & REAL Credit Offsets Category: Community -------------------- Film-Yak Film Handlers' Movie Reviews The Afterlife Bob Maar's Joke-A-Thon Category: Classified -------------------- Equipment and Supplies Wanted/For Sale Help Wanted/Seeking Employment Category: System -------------------- Software Beta Testing Forum

The Film-Tech Forums are designed for various members related to the cinema industry to express their opinions, viewpoints and testimonials on various products, services and events based upon speculation, personal knowledge and factual information through use, therefore all views represented here allow no liability upon the publishers of this web site and the owners of said views assume no liability for any ill will resulting from these postings. The posts made here are for educational as well as entertainment purposes and as such anyone viewing this portion of the website must accept these views as statements of the author of that opinion and agrees to release the authors from any and all liability.