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Author Topic: Splicing together black cells Dan Chilton Expert Film Handler Posts: 191 From: Springfield, MO Registered: Mar 2004 posted 09-21-2005 01:39 PM                        This is a newbie question, but I'm hoping one of the experts here can give me some tips. When you have a trailer that fades to black, obscuring frame lines, and a movie that fades in from black, how do you know where to cut and splice? The soundtrack doesn't give any hints.  |  IP: Logged Jeremy Fuentes Mmmm, Dr. Pepper! Posts: 1168 From: Corpus Christi, TX United States Registered: Jan 2004 posted 09-21-2005 01:47 PM                     What I do, is take your clear leader and line it up with a visible frame line before the fade out, stretch out the leader, and cut as far to the end of the trailer as I can. Pretty easy way, or you can cut where the trailer ends and the trailer ID info starts and hope that its in frame. I'm sure these other guys have better techniques though.  |  IP: Logged Wolff King Morrow Master Film Handler Posts: 490 From: Denton, TX, USA Registered: Feb 2004 posted 09-21-2005 02:04 PM                        For trailers, you usually have a tail section with a bunch of color patterns and other garbage that is all in frame. I just measure back some frames into the black from one of those frames and chop. The trailer has always come out in frame for me doing it that way. Some trailers actually provide framing markers for chopping anyway, which makes it easier.  |  IP: Logged Alexander Smith Expert Film Handler Posts: 128 From: Walney Island, Barrow-in-Furness, Cumbria. Registered: Jun 2003 posted 09-21-2005 02:09 PM                     As Jeremy suggests, using a bit of mylar leader (printed with frame lines) is the easiest way to do it. I think of it as a portable frame counter. My "film counter" is exactly 2 seconds long which helps us place cues for our automation in _just_ the right place also. It's worth remembering that the [optical] sound is 20 frames ahead of the picture when editing trailers together. Alex.  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 09-21-2005 02:15 PM                     Check out all of this trailer editing/splicing in the "tips" section of FT, and Brad beat me to it..(LOL, thx Brad) -Monte  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 09-21-2005 02:15 PM                     The TIPS page has some guidelines on where to cut trailers for assembly, but that was made about 5 years ago and many studios have changed their leaders, so they aren't all exactly like what is shown...but the principles are the same. Do beware that nowadays the labs have been getting sloppy and rather than cutting 1 frame over from the head/tail into the black you should cut 2 frames over. Otherwise you get the negative tape lines showing in the picture. (Hold the film up to the light, look through it and you will see.) If you are in a hurry, use the splicer technique. Halfway down that page in the link above you will see how it works at the picture of a Neumade splier.  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 09-21-2005 02:29 PM                        Every booth should have either a sync block or a Neumade Film Measuring Machine. If yours doesn't, you can take an old sprocket and mark where the framelines will fall (a 16-tooth sprocket covers exactly four frames). Then, line up a known-good frameline with the frameline marked on the splicer/sync block and pull the film through the machine. Then, note where the framelines should be and cut there. Simple and easy. Be sure to cut before or after any sync pops or handwriting on the soundtrack. For reels that begin with a fadein from black, count exactly 47 frames of black after the "3" (Academy) or "2" (SMPTE) on the leader before cutting. For reels that end with a fade to black, count exactly 24 frames (occasionally 18...check another reel to see what scheme was used on that print) after the frame with the last changeover cue mark. Whenever I go into a new or ill-equipped booth, I bring along a film can that contains (among other items) a few feet of black frameline leader, which has saved quite a bit of time.  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 09-21-2005 02:40 PM                     Course, I've trained my eyes in looking at the leader and finding the first frame of the beginning of that reel's picture, tik the edge of the film with a marker and go from there-even on the very dark, fade in/out scenes. Another old trick to find fadeout framelines was to find the second set of cuemarks and to down about 2ft and you can find that negative splice at the end. Lotsa tricks to use in doing a "changeover" splice. -Monte  |  IP: Logged Heath Dutton Film Handler Posts: 37 From: Montgomery, Alabama / United States of America Registered: Jul 2005 posted 09-21-2005 04:57 PM                     Well, my solution is somewhat less conventional... I hated using the clear leaders for doing this because they would easily slip, so I looked through the projection supply room and found an old top cam that had been replaced (because it was leaky). I took the top cam and some parts of old broken film-clamps and made a mount for it. So it grabs onto the side of the make-up table with the cam facing me... I then used a sharpie to mark out the frames between the teeth, and voila! My frame checker! Of course this would only work if you have a spare cam lying around and it's teeth are divisible by 4, but it's worked wonders for me. I use it on almost every print and havn't had a mis-splice in about a year. An old projectionist came by recently and let me borrow his frame-checker, which was made very much the same way (but with an intermittent I believe).  |  IP: Logged Dan Chilton Expert Film Handler Posts: 191 From: Springfield, MO Registered: Mar 2004 posted 09-21-2005 04:58 PM                        Great tips. I had read the TIPS page awhile back, but I completely forgot about the 8 frame trick with the Neumade splicer. Damn you Broken Flowers trailer being attached to Me & You & Everyone We Know! I have to wait until tonight to correct my splicing error... until then, I'm destined to reframe it after the splice. Argh.  |  IP: Logged Heath Dutton Film Handler Posts: 37 From: Montgomery, Alabama / United States of America Registered: Jul 2005 posted 09-21-2005 05:09 PM                     it shouldn't be hard to fix a splice if you notice how it is out of frame on screen (for a quick fix)... If it jumps up or down 50% of the screen, just take out 2 notches and resplice. If it jumps up 25% then take out 1 notch. If it jumps down 25% then take out 3 notches... Is my math right there guys?  |  IP: Logged Kenneth Wuepper Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1026 From: Saginaw, MI, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 09-21-2005 05:30 PM                     Heath, Correcting a misframe at any point in a print or trailer pack is done as you described. Your math is just upside down (as the image is in the gate). If the frame line moves up from the bottom of the screen 25%, you need to remove 3 sprocket holes from the tail of the outgoing film. If the frame line drops from the top 25% then you need to remove the one extra sprocket hole of film from the tail of the outgoing film. It is best to remake the original splice to prevent lost continuity and extra splices. Your thinking is good but you did not account for the inverted and reversed image in the gate. KEN  |  IP: Logged Adam Martin I'm not even gonna point out the irony. Posts: 3686 From: Dallas, TX Registered: Nov 2000 posted 09-21-2005 07:33 PM                     But is the outgoing film cut out of frame or is it the incoming film that's cut out of frame? You don't know unless you re-make the splice, measuring where the frame lines are. *That* is the correct thing to do (short of doing it right the first time ). Otherwise, the next film to get that trailer (or feature, if that's where the splice is) stands a 50% chance of being out of frame because you took a shortcut.  |  IP: Logged Wolff King Morrow Master Film Handler Posts: 490 From: Denton, TX, USA Registered: Feb 2004 posted 09-22-2005 02:15 AM                        If ever there's a mis-splice, I correct it the old fassioned way by taking my frame counter to the splice in question and actually measuring from each end which side is short. I've had projectionists who've worked twice as long in the booth as I have actually try to guess on the screen position and get it wrong all day. I come in and get it corrected for absolute certain the first try because I don't want to have to hassle with it more than one time.  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 09-22-2005 02:30 AM                     (..wonder if anyone know how to fix a misframe splice during the scrolling credits.....) -Monte  |  IP: Logged

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