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» Film-Tech Forum   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » The Single Worst Use of CAP Code, Ever: A Rant (Page 1)

 
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Author Topic: The Single Worst Use of CAP Code, Ever: A Rant
Mark Ogden
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 834
From: Little Falls, N.J.
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 08-03-2004 09:27 PM      Profile for Mark Ogden   Email Mark Ogden   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
So the Little Lady™ and I don’t agree on a helluvalot, except that we both really enjoy the film Before Sunrise (it’s like, our movie, see?). So we were both delighted to hear that there was a sequel called Before Sunset out in theatres, and tonight we took ourselves over to the Rialto in Ridgefield Park to see if Jesse and Celine ever returned to the train station in Vienna where their mutual lust began. Celine, OBTW, is played by the drop dead beautiful Julie Delpy, may her name be spoken with pure sex forever.

So it’s late in the movie, and Celine and Jesse are in the back of a limousine, and she is finally pouring out her frustration at not seeing him for nine years, and she’s just beside herself at how frustrating all of her relationships have been since then because she continues to measure them against that one night they had together years ago, and she’s crying her eyes out, and it’s a fine bit of acting and a beautifully composed shot, and your heart is breaking for this woman . . . and then what do you think goes flying by just at that moment, right across her angelic face?

So, like, did some sick schmuck actually sit down and watch this film to determine what would be the single WORST spot to insert an anti-piracy gimmick? Is that what happened here, Sparky? I mean, you’ve gotta be freakin’ kidding me with this shit! Right over this woman’s face, at the absolute emotional peak of the film! Red Dots!! I mean, what the hell is going on here, ya know!?! Can’t whoever is responsible for this be just a tad more judicious about where he aims his freakin’ bingo card marker, and when? Huh? Huh? Huh?

I mean, hey, c’mon.

Okay. Deep, calming breaths . . . .

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17590
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99


 - posted 08-03-2004 09:29 PM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
Master and Commander was incredibly bad. More recently I noticed it was disrupting in Girl Next Door and Village. Some prints it's there but it's so small I can tune it out, others are IN YOUR FACE!!!

I say we should use this thread to log bad CAP coded prints and see if we can come up with a pattern.

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Wolff King Morrow
Master Film Handler

Posts: 490
From: Denton, TX, USA
Registered: Feb 2004


 - posted 08-03-2004 10:31 PM      Profile for Wolff King Morrow   Author's Homepage   Email Wolff King Morrow   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I recall seeing them show up multiple times on "Man on Fire". I never really paid attention to them before, but they were a little too obvious when I watched that movie.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 08-03-2004 10:54 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
There are a variety of CAP Code methods in use today, each associated with a particular laboratory. The newer codes are likely evolving to make them less noticeable, yet more robust for tracking pirated videos. It is not inconceivable that multiple types of watermarking may be used on a given print.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12856
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 08-03-2004 11:17 PM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Both The Vilage and Spiderman 2 had extremely bad CAP code. I'm glad studios feel that it is worth ruing the movie just to save a couple of bucks. Watching a movie in a movie theater just isn't a good experience anymore, and CAP code plays a very large percentage of that reason.

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10540
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 08-03-2004 11:22 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
CAP code is generally so bad that I expect to see those digital measels and security chicken pox appear on just about any shot in the movie with a bright or nearly white background.

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Mark J. Marshall
Film God

Posts: 3172
From: New Castle, DE, USA
Registered: Aug 2002


 - posted 08-04-2004 09:14 AM      Profile for Mark J. Marshall     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I cut CAP code frames out of Men In Black II because they popped up when they were in that giant white toilet room thing. These giant orange spots showed up like "BANG!" and half the audience said, "What the hell was THAT??"

What was interesting to me was the dots extended beyond the 1.85 frame. WTF is the point of that? If I video tape the movie in the theater, how will they use the dots that don't show up on the video to tell where I was when I did it?

Maybe the CRAP Coding machine was mis-calibrated or something.

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Paul Mayer
Oh get out of it Melvin, before it pulls you under!

Posts: 3833
From: Albuquerque, NM
Registered: Feb 2000


 - posted 08-04-2004 11:41 AM      Profile for Paul Mayer   Author's Homepage   Email Paul Mayer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The ones I saw on The Village were rather large and blurry, like someone had dripped chemistry on the print.

Maybe we should start treating CRAP code like lab splices.
When you find an offending frame, cut it out. [evil]

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David Stambaugh
Film God

Posts: 4007
From: Eugene, Oregon
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 08-04-2004 11:49 AM      Profile for David Stambaugh   Author's Homepage   Email David Stambaugh   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Master and Commander is probably the most egregious example I've ever witnessed. [thumbsdown] [puke]

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 15887
From: Bountiful, Utah
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 08-04-2004 11:57 AM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
So has anyone ever really been caught pirating by way of cap code anyway? Or was this just something Valenti cooked up?

Mark

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Ron Yost
Master Film Handler

Posts: 344
From: Paso Robles, CA
Registered: Aug 2003


 - posted 08-04-2004 12:00 PM      Profile for Ron Yost   Email Ron Yost   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I wonder if it's 'legal' to cut out the CAP code?? Is it, in any way, a violation of booking agreements? Can there be consequences for a theatre if it's discovered they're cutting the frames??

Ron Yost

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Christopher Duvall
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 500
From: Denver, CO
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 08-04-2004 12:29 PM      Profile for Christopher Duvall   Email Christopher Duvall   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I would plead ignorance and cut them anyway. I would just say that I saw red damage on a few frames and cut them out like lab splices.

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Mark J. Marshall
Film God

Posts: 3172
From: New Castle, DE, USA
Registered: Aug 2002


 - posted 08-04-2004 12:45 PM      Profile for Mark J. Marshall     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Exactly. If it's a problem for the studios, I'll splice them back in when the print leaves. But as far as I'm concerned giant orange dots in the middle of the frame of white is a "print defect." Especially when I can stand in the back of the theater and hear a murmer start amongst the audience members when the dots go through.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12856
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 08-04-2004 01:01 PM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Mark,
John Pytlak says that CAP code has helped in the past. Not sure about this current version. He won't site any specific examples, though. So as far as I'm concerned, it's all speculation.

Also, as far as removing CAP code not being "legal", did any theaters sign an agreement saying they would not? NO! There is nothing they can do. You just have to decide on which is more annoying, the CAP code or the missing frames. Unfortunately it is a lose-lose situation. Quality is not a priority for the labs that do this.

Also, do the studios know how incredibly easy it is for would-be pirates to go in and delete the frames where CAP code is visable before encoding into MPEG/DIVX/Whatever? People who pirate movies will most likely also pirate software programs like Adobe Premiere or Vegas Video or some crappy NLE. It could be done easily. This immediately makes CAP code 100% useless.

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Jesse Skeen
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1494
From: Sacramento, CA
Registered: Aug 2000


 - posted 08-04-2004 03:04 PM      Profile for Jesse Skeen   Email Jesse Skeen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Since I have to pay for my movies now, I've given up on going to any mainstream movie now because of the crap dots along with the substandard presentation in the area (including visible lights-up cues that ruin the ending, which complaining about has done no good)- with the prices theatres charge I'm better off waiting til I can buy the legitimately-produced DVD for just a couple dollars more than a theater ticket. Video done right still beats film done wrong.
I've noticed crap-coding going back to "Nutty Professor 2" but I assumed that they were just some sort of defect. Knowing now that they're put there intentionally, I would request replacement reels for anything I noticed the crap dots on. Changeover cues are disrupting enough, but at least they serve a purpose for somebody somewhere (they do need to stop using those too though, and use them only on prints that they KNOW are going to a changeover house.)
I know most theatres don't care about presentation quality (they may say they do, but not actually deliver), but somebody somewhere has got to put their foot down and tell the people behind this that it's simply unacceptable. At the very least, be a pain in the ass and keep rejecting prints that have the crap-dots- can a theatre refuse to run a film if they think the print isn't in optimum condition?

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