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» Film-Tech Forum   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » Seeking Info On FP-20 (Page 1)

 
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Author Topic: Seeking Info On FP-20
Michael Coate
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1838
From: Los Angeles, California
Registered: Feb 2001


 - posted 07-01-2004 11:47 PM      Profile for Michael Coate   Email Michael Coate   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Anyone familiar with the FP-20 projector? I'm seeking the following information: (1) manufacturer, and (2) 35/70mm capable, or 35mm-only?

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Steve Kraus
Film God

Posts: 3987
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Registered: May 2000


 - posted 07-02-2004 12:25 AM      Profile for Steve Kraus     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Norelco, 35mm.

See one here:
www.film-tech.com/pics/empire2/empire2.html

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William Hooper
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1879
From: Mobile, AL USA
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 07-02-2004 12:28 AM      Profile for William Hooper   Author's Homepage   Email William Hooper   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Norelco, 35mm only.

There's a Norelco/Kinoton model list at

http://www.kinotonamerica.com/support/index.asp

Edited to correct hideous brain fart

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Peter Hall
Master Film Handler

Posts: 298
From: London, UK
Registered: Dec 2000


 - posted 07-02-2004 01:07 PM      Profile for Peter Hall   Author's Homepage   Email Peter Hall   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Did Norelco ever exist as a manufacturer or was it a rebadge ? Not sure if Norelco kit was both Philips and Kinoton ?

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Mitchell Dvoskin
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1790
From: West Milford, NJ, USA
Registered: Jan 2001


 - posted 07-02-2004 02:33 PM      Profile for Mitchell Dvoskin   Email Mitchell Dvoskin   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Norelco was the brand name for Philips projectors. When they exited the projector biz, everything was sold to Kinoton.

Edited to fix the mis-spelling in Philips.

[ 07-03-2004, 11:28 AM: Message edited by: Mitchell Dvoskin ]

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Steve Kraus
Film God

Posts: 3987
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Registered: May 2000


 - posted 07-02-2004 03:48 PM      Profile for Steve Kraus     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Is Kinotone a spinoff of the former Philips/Norelco projection operation or did it previously exist in its own right? Is it presently part of some larger concern or independent?

[Only one "l" in Philips, btw.)

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Richard Fowler
Film God

Posts: 2381
From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA
Registered: Jun 2001


 - posted 07-02-2004 05:42 PM      Profile for Richard Fowler   Email Richard Fowler   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Kinoton was formed in Munich, Germany in 1948 as a service shop for the cinema industry. In the middle 1950's Mr. Zoller, an employee, and his wife bought the company and expanded it countrywide. Philips sold the rights to their projection equipment in 1972 to their capable hands. Renate Zoller, the daughter, continues the family involvement in operations worldwide.

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Bill Gabel
Film God

Posts: 3873
From: Technicolor / Postworks NY, USA
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 07-06-2004 09:02 AM      Profile for Bill Gabel   Email Bill Gabel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Michael

Magna-Tech's version of the FP-20 is known as the PR-135 Studio Projector.

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9390
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 07-06-2004 09:07 AM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The Magna Tech PR135 only had a visual similarity between the fp20 and it
The PR135 was a stepper motor drive system having no intermitent and the skates sprockets and pads were none interchangable. The only common element was the optical soundhead
MTM marketed an FP30 mounted in one of there dubber cases

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Mitchell Dvoskin
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1790
From: West Milford, NJ, USA
Registered: Jan 2001


 - posted 07-06-2004 12:26 PM      Profile for Mitchell Dvoskin   Email Mitchell Dvoskin   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The Loews Jersey in Jersey City has a pair of Magna-Tech P135's, which do NOT have a stepper motor, do have an intermittent, and use the identical skates, sprockets and pads. The Magna-Tech enhancements to these FP20's were the motor assisted startup of the sound drum, the ability to select electric back tension on the feed reel for both emulsion in or out, and the ability to run backwards.

/Mitchell

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Bill Gabel
Film God

Posts: 3873
From: Technicolor / Postworks NY, USA
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 07-06-2004 12:39 PM      Profile for Bill Gabel   Email Bill Gabel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The Magna-Tech's I have here in Manhattan are just as Mitchell discribed that are over at the Loew's Jersey.

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Stephen Furley
Film God

Posts: 3040
From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England
Registered: May 2002


 - posted 07-06-2004 01:40 PM      Profile for Stephen Furley   Email Stephen Furley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
This is one of the machines at the Loew's:

 -

I've never seen that design of lamphouse table before, and it has an interlock motor, but the rest of the mechanical parts look pretty standard for a lateish FP-20. Something else that is a bit odd, the take-up will obviously only take a 2000 foot spool, but the feed spindle is at the very top of the column, and it's not a short column version. The two machines are not quite identical, and one has a blanked-off position for a 6000 foot spool, while the other (this one) does not. At least one machine has about four or five blanked-off top spindle positions, maybe designed to be equipped for double head working, with 1000 foot rolls of mag?

I hope to get back o see the Loew's, and the Lafayette, Suffern, and maybe a couple of other places, again next year.

Philips/Kinoton have always tended to produce many variations of the standard machines, with lots of options available. I've seen many of them, and almost no two are identical.

Their equipment was also marketed under many names, their flashbulbs were sold in the U.S.A. as 'Amplex', and their video recorders in some parts of the world in the late '60s - early '70s as 'Peto-Scott' (I'm not sure if that had one 't', or two). I'm not sure where the 'Norelco' name came from.

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9390
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 07-06-2004 06:06 PM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
that lamphouse table was made by ballantyne when they were assembling the norelco line for them in the US and sorry i was thinking of the later 636 machine that is a stepper drive

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Sam D. Chavez
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1977
From: Martinez, CA USA
Registered: Aug 2003


 - posted 07-06-2004 09:16 PM      Profile for Sam D. Chavez   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The MTE version of the FP20 Optical soundhead is very similar but not entirely identical. The drum is a bit different and it as well as the casting was made by MTE and not by Philips.

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Larry Shaw
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 237
From: Boston, MA, USA
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 07-13-2004 09:28 PM      Profile for Larry Shaw   Author's Homepage   Email Larry Shaw   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Norelco was a wholly owned subsiduary of Philips that distributed certian Philips products in North America.

Kinoton's story is summarized nicely by Richard. For more see http://www.kinotonamerica.com/company/index.asp . Kinotone, Inc was a North American distribution division of Kinoton GmbH, which was later owned by US interests when Kinoton GmbH chose not to operate its own N. A. offices. Kinotone has been out of business for many years although some folks keep using the name.

The Philips or Kinoton machines have only been sold in N. A. as Philips, Norelco, Kinoton or Kinotone. That said, some buyers may put their own labels on after they purchase the machines, like MTE.

To further confise the PR-135 story, The early ones were in fact standard FP-20's that MTE bought whole and reworked. As time went buy they started copying more and more of philips' parts until the last ones were all MTE made, although some parts were essentially identical, for example the lens holder.

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