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Author Topic: Art House film formats
Matt Hale
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 123
From: Vancouver, Canada
Registered: Dec 2002


 - posted 02-25-2003 12:41 PM      Profile for Matt Hale   Author's Homepage   Email Matt Hale   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hypothetically speaking, if you were going to open your own single-screen Art House theatre, what formats/gear would you install? And in what priority?

I am thinking the contenders are:

35mm platter
35mm changeover (2000' and/or 6000' reels)
16mm
DLP (or other semi-decent video projection)

You would be showing several different films a week, mostly independent, low-budget, foreign, and even student films, as well as festival screenings, and possibly 1 or 2 first-run features a year.

Also, what sound formats would you install? How about the soundheads? Would you convert to the reverse-scan led type or attempt to fix your broken exciter lamp setup?

Thanks.

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Joe Beres
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 606
From: Minneapolis, MN, USA
Registered: Nov 2000


 - posted 02-25-2003 12:54 PM      Profile for Joe Beres   Email Joe Beres   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
First and foremost, I would install 35mm. That's what gets people in the seats. Having changeover capability (and even more importantly a capable projectionist) would be enormously beneficial for festival screenings and short runs. You could run automated 6000' reels for longer runs. 16mm would be nice also for other indie and student work. If you have a longer throw and/or a larger screen, you'll probably want a 1k or 2k pedestal projector. If you have a shorter throw and/or a smaller screen, you could get 350w or 550w portable 16mm projectors. (If you have a good amount of money, you could look into getting a Kinoton changeover with one of the two projectors having 16/35 capability.) I prefer Eiki slotloads myself. Video would be a great addition, and in some ways more useful than 16mm. I don't think the cost of DLP is worth it, but a bright projector with a good native resolution would be a great addition to the booth. It would be good to have Beta SP, DVCam/MiniDV, DVD and VHS playback capability.

If you are working with existing equipment, I don't think that LED conversion is a necessity at this point. If you were going to choose a digital system, Dolby SRD readers and the appropriate rack gear would be the way to go. SRD seems to be the most common digital format on foreign and indie films, but digital could be easily done sometime later.

Good luck!

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 02-25-2003 01:12 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Single screen and running a print less than a handful of times usually is best served by changeover projection. For art films, be sure to have lenses and masking to properly show all aspect ratios: 1.37:1, 1.66:1, 1.85:1 and 2.39:1 "scope". If you intend to specialize in silent film or other original formats (e.g., 2.55:1 mag CinemaScope), consider variable speed drive, 3-blade shutters, and ability to shift centerline, in choosing your projectors. Cost of digital projection will depend on screen size and quality expectations, as well as having playback capability for the recording format used. Many theatres RENT digital equipment for particular requirements (e.g., if you need to play a D-5 HD tape) rather than purchase equipment for each format.

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 02-25-2003 01:13 PM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
For an art house the basics are
two 35mm machines that are capable of extremely steady image projection and very gentle on damaged prints
Lens that can resolve 80line per mm
picture formats that are the min requirement 1.33:1 1.66:1 1.85:1 and scope
For sound a processor that is of studio quality (panastereo) and at least DTS or Dolby digital (the choice there will rest with the source product and the format availablity in your area
Lamphouse's that can provide 18 fl of light (more is always better)
I recomend a curved silver screen if the room geometry permits to allow 3d projection
Also for archival the capability of 4 track magnetic and double system

A professional 16mm is also handy

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 02-25-2003 01:19 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Gordon's suggestion of having plenty of light and a properly curved silver screen to accomodate 3D is a good one. 3D revivals can be popular. The high gain screen also helps compensate for less efficient digital projectors.

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Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 02-25-2003 02:00 PM      Profile for Scott Norwood   Author's Homepage   Email Scott Norwood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Don't forget to have a really, really good splicer (Neumade) and rewind bench (Kelmar). Many art-house prints will arrive in terrible condition and will need to be repaired properly before being shown. Many such venues seem to have lousy rewind/inspection facilities, though. A perf-fix machine would be good, too.

Agreed with the others' comments--the equipment minimum should be a 35mm changeover booth with 6000' capability for longer runs. Others will disagree, but I think that 16mm is worthwhile if you can get a good used xenon machine for $5000 or so. Try to get a 16mm machine which can play magnetic tracks (Eikis can). Unless you will be showing mostly repertory titles with mono tracks, a good Dolby sound system (not necessarily digital) is important. A platter might be nice to have, too, for longer runs, but isn't essential if your operator is good and booth space is limited.

Since video equipment keeps getting better and cheaper, I'd take John's suggestion and rent what you need for occasional screenings. If you end up doing a lot of video work (festivals, etc.), then you probably should consider purchasing a medium-grade DLP machine and renting the playback decks. Beta SP seems to be the most popular format for festivals, but the playback hardware starts in the $8000 range. Not to mention that there will be occasional need for Digibeta, DVCAM, 3/4, SVHS, and other formats.

Don't go cheap on lenses. Too many theatres have crappy-looking scope images, which is completely unacceptible. Also, don't think that you will be able to get away without having 1.33 or 1.66 capability--you will need it sooner or later. You aren't likely to need 16mm scope capability, though. [Frown]

If you have extra cash and there is a chance that you will be showing workprints or doing special screenings, consider a DA-88 machine and/or mag dubbers, along with a shaft encoder which can output timecode on the projector motors. Selsyn interlock for 3D would be good, too.

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Matt Hale
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 123
From: Vancouver, Canada
Registered: Dec 2002


 - posted 02-25-2003 02:13 PM      Profile for Matt Hale   Author's Homepage   Email Matt Hale   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks guys, this is all great info.

I had not even thought of 3D...that could be very cool. Screen size would be in the area of 40' Would a 3kw bulb be bright enough to get away without a special screen?

The auditorium would be used for other things during the day, so video & 1 Simplex XL projector are a given. I'm just trying to figure how much extra stuff I would have to add to make it workable as a public venue, Art House being about the only format that would have any chance of succeeding in the neighborhood.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 02-25-2003 02:25 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
3000 watts would be underpowered for a 17 x 40 foot matte white screen, but pretty good for a properly curved high gain screen. But if you intend to show 3D or use a 3-blade shutter, even more power would be better.

Digital projection for that size screen will be quite expensive if you hope to have at least 12 footlamberts. A 17 x 30 foot (16:9) image will require at least a 6000 lumen projector.

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99


 - posted 02-25-2003 03:50 PM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
35mm with changeover (2 projectors) - don't bother with a platter since you won't be showing a film more than a few times.

1.33 / 1.66 / 1.85 / 2.39 formats with moveable masking (ideally 3 sided)

Buy only Schneider or ISCO lenses.

CA21 automations for manual or automated changeovers

Kinoton Cinemecannica, Christie, Century or Simplex projectors

Kinoton or Christie SLC lamphouses

Dolby sound system with Dolby Digital. Do NOT buy dts or sdds for an art house!!! [Mad]

Neumade 35SS splicer and quality clear splicing tape (Neumade makes the best tape)

---------------

16mm projector with 6000' reel capability

Portable DLP projector capable of at least 3000 lumens (more is better if you can afford it)

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Daryl C. W. O'Shea
Film God

Posts: 3977
From: Midland Ontario Canada (where Panavision & IMAX lenses come from)
Registered: Jun 2002


 - posted 02-25-2003 04:30 PM      Profile for Daryl C. W. O'Shea   Author's Homepage   Email Daryl C. W. O'Shea   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Don't forget your favorite type of online film cleaner for both projectors. Some rep prints are really dirty. [Frown]

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Steve Guttag
We forgot the crackers Gromit!!!

Posts: 12814
From: Annapolis, MD
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 02-25-2003 05:29 PM      Profile for Steve Guttag   Email Steve Guttag   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I sell a large quantity of art/rep equipment...as the industry goes.

By far, the most common set up is 2-projector 2K or 6K reels.

For digital sound Dolby Digital is the most prolific in independant/art market

As for analog sound...visible red LEDs are not your friend...they will give the older titles a harsh sound quality and on some tracks completely unacceptable quality. An exciter lamp or infrared LED based system would be best. If you plan to just run newer stuff, the red LEDs will be fine.

Generally, I'm finding the order of equipment preference is 35mm, video and then 16mm. 16mm is still there but if you can only afford one or the other, you will use your video projector more than your 16mm projector.

Silent seems to be popular...we sell lots of variable speed set-ups lately. I am of the mind that the only real way to do silent is with a 3-phase motor and a motor controller. Silent films came in many speeds (and some are to be adjusted on the fly during the movie)...a motor controller can let you do this. If you don't have a Kinoton "E" series projector, consider a 3-wing shutter if you plan to do this often. For a once in a blue-moon type of set up...people can learn why they were called "flicks."

As far as automation goes...most such venues have an operator so the automation is a luxury...there are several to choose from now..Kelmar, Pennywise (trading under Christie and Kinoton names), and Panalogic (the panastereo people) all have capable 2-projector automations.

Steve

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 02-25-2003 06:20 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
DTS and SDDS are both rarely used on true independent film releases. Years ago, DD dominated the art house scene largely because a lot of art house product is imported European films. During the early to mid 1990's Dolby was selling a lot more DD systems to European circuits who seemed more enamored of the Dolby brand rather than so many American circuits buying lots of DTS units for the "Digital" buzzword.

There are those rare cases, such as one of the European releases of "Trainspotting" playing in DTS whereas it played in the U.S. in Dolby Digital. A good number of French films jumped on the DTS-DD thing in the mid 1990's.

These days, I suppose Dolby Digital has a lot of marketing leverage on title support as a direct avenue to home video. Do movie productions pay Dolby Labs separate licensing fees for a theatrical release? I wonder about that since most any DVD release requires a new DD encoding at a different bitrate from the theatrical system.

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Ian Price
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1714
From: Denver, CO
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 02-25-2003 07:17 PM      Profile for Ian Price   Email Ian Price   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Don't open a single screen. Showing movies for less than one week will kill you with film shipping costs. We run a 5-screen and wish for 8.

Vancouver has plenty of art houses. They have so many that they even have an Art Sub-Run house. Study your competition very closely.

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Matt Hale
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 123
From: Vancouver, Canada
Registered: Dec 2002


 - posted 02-25-2003 08:40 PM      Profile for Matt Hale   Author's Homepage   Email Matt Hale   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
These days, I suppose Dolby Digital has a lot of marketing leverage on title support as a direct avenue to home video. Do movie productions pay Dolby Labs separate licensing fees for a theatrical release? I wonder about that since most any DVD release requires a new DD encoding at a different bitrate from the theatrical system.
I havent spoken to the front office guys about this for a while, but last I recall, yes, Dobly charged a seperate licence fee for each format and each use, but would usually cut a deal on a "Package" of licences. So if you bought "worldwide theatrical Dolby Digital" + "worldwide theatrial SR" + "North American Home DD" it would be a fair bit cheaper than buying your theatrical rights for realease, then buying home use rights 6 months later when you found out there was demand for home video copies. I can think of several shows that bought the package, only to find they needn't have bothered with the home rights (or the theatrical in some cases)

I think perhaps the term "Underground" would be a better description than Art House of the kind of stuff they're thinking of showing. A good portion of it seems to be produced on Super8. I have yet to figure out how we would ever get Super8 on a 40' screen. Probably couldnt be done - would have to insist on either a video transfer or having it blown up to 16mm. Ugh. We need to have 35mm anyway, so that is a given. I can just picture the booth wall with about 7 port windows in it, and horrible keystoning from the side projectors.

This whole thing is not my idea, I just have to see if I can make it work.

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