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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » What was that paint again... (Projector Rebuild) (Page 1)

 
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Author Topic: What was that paint again... (Projector Rebuild)
Randy Loy
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 156

Registered: Aug 1999


 - posted 08-27-2002 02:13 PM      Profile for Randy Loy   Email Randy Loy   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Last winter I posted a message about my plans to rebuild a vintage Simplex Standard projector head that I had acquired from a friend who owns a cinema equipment company. He obtained the machine, with a VERY old RCA soundhead, and pedestal as part of a lot when he was buying newer projection equipment out of a long-closed theatre.

John Eickhof has been very helpful with advising me on the vintage of my Simplex Standard, it was manufactured in late 1927, and has advised me on paint colors used during the initial manufacturing of these units and subsequent factory rebuilds.

My question now is about the brand/s of paints that you guys have found best suited for this task. As I recall, in response to my thread of last winter, people suggested products called something like "Hammertone" or "Hammerite." I've not found anything like this in my local hardware stores. Is my memory faulty regarding the product names?

Any suggestions on what paint I should use? I want to use glossy paints since the unit had a glossy, not textured exterior finish when new. Also, should the paint be heat resistant? I'm assuming it should be since the xenon lamp will generate heat against the rear of the casing, separated only by the rear shutter and shutter housing.


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Bernard Tonks
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 619
From: Cranleigh, Surrey, England
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 08-27-2002 04:26 PM      Profile for Bernard Tonks   Email Bernard Tonks   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I was one of the contributors, and recommended Hammerite Enamel gloss white radiator paint. It is extremely hard wearing and heat resistant, and will never fade. Only get the spirit based, do not use water based as it runs too much on application. You will need to apply three coats for a good and strong whiter than white finish. I did my 32 year old Westars (Century) and they looked brand new. WARNING Do not use ordinary Hammerite quick drying cellulose (spelling?) white, it will discolour and yellow within six months! I don’t suppose the radiator variety is available in all states of America, hot climates like Florida has no need for radiators possibly? Sure you will be able to track down a supplier somewhere. Hammerite UK www.hammerite.com

Edit: USA is: www.masterchem.com But they do not appear to stock all Hammerite products from the UK. Perhaps Masterchem will import the radiator paint on special request. Or you contact Hammerite in the UK yourself. E-mail if I can be of any further help e.g you cannot obtain the product or suitable alternatives.



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Gordon Bachlund
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 696
From: Monrovia, CA, USA
Registered: Aug 1999


 - posted 08-27-2002 07:18 PM      Profile for Gordon Bachlund   Author's Homepage   Email Gordon Bachlund   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I used Hammerite bronze to touch up my Kinoton equipment.

While some colors are available from Home Depot, I had to special order the bronze from a friendly paint dealer.

A word of caution. Shake the spray cans thoroughly so that the pigments mix well or the "hammered" appearance of the finish will be compromised.

Good luck.

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Bill Mantz
Film Handler

Posts: 91
From: Plano, TX
Registered: Feb 2001


 - posted 08-27-2002 09:56 PM      Profile for Bill Mantz   Email Bill Mantz   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I Just finished resoring my Super Simplex and SH-1000 Sound head. I too had a problem finding the Hammerite paints to restore my projector I e-mail the company who disiruted the paints in the U.S. and they said any True Value hardware stores carry them. But I still could not find the Wrinke Finish that matched the original, but one day a catalog came in the mail and had all the paints that I needed to restore all of my old projectors. www.eastwoodco.com
Hope you find what you looking for

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Sam Hunter
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 779
From: West Monroe, LA, USA
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 08-27-2002 10:04 PM      Profile for Sam Hunter   Email Sam Hunter   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hey guys,
in regards to Wrinkle coat finishes, is it true that in order for the paint to "wrinkle" properly you have to place whatever you just sprayed in an oven or will it work ok on its on?

------------------
Samuel Hunter Sr.

Death to DLP (Video)

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John Eickhof
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 588
From: Wendell, ID USA
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 08-27-2002 10:13 PM      Profile for John Eickhof   Author's Homepage   Email John Eickhof   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The 'wrinkle' finish paints will wrinkle on their own, however the paint has to be applied in several thick coats and must be above 70 degrees. Heat lamps will speed up the process and make fine wrinkles as opposed to course wrinkles if dried at room temperature. Remember, Standard and super simplexes were never wrinkle finish prior to 1940. They were always gloss black inside and out. If they were rebuilt by NTS / IPC after 1940 they were wrinkle black on the outside, and appliance white inside. An excellent US made paint is 'Rust-O-leum'
it is petro based and applies very well. If you use Eastwood paints, be sure to shake frequently, especially the wrinkle colors. Have fun!

------------------
John Eickhof President, Chief Slave
Northwest Theatre Equipment Co., Inc.
P.O.Box 258
Wendell, ID. 83355-0258
208-536-5489
email: jeickhof@nteequip.com

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Bill Mantz
Film Handler

Posts: 91
From: Plano, TX
Registered: Feb 2001


 - posted 08-27-2002 11:11 PM      Profile for Bill Mantz   Email Bill Mantz   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Johns right put on a thick coat of the wrinkle paint and then wait 5 minutes and put on another thick coat. as to baking it the paint will bubble and them you will have to strip it and try again. It take 24 hours to fully wrinkle and after that so parts my still be wet so wait 48 hours before you handle it. The Hammerite white gloss can be bake and after its done the white finish will be the off white color that was used in the later Simplexes.

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Ken Layton
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1452
From: Olympia, Wash. USA
Registered: Sep 1999


 - posted 08-28-2002 12:27 AM      Profile for Ken Layton   Email Ken Layton   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Funny, I never had a problem baking wrinkle paint in the oven. I use 3 coats of wrinkle applied thus: one coat sprayed horizontally, wait five minutes, spray a coat vertically, wait five minutes, then spray the final coat diagonally. Bake in the oven on middle rack at 190 degrees for 50 minutes and let parts cool down naturally. I can start reassembling the parts after about 3 hours.
One note: the parts being painted should have a temperature of around 80 to 90 degrees as the paint is being sprayed on them.

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Bernard Tonks
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 619
From: Cranleigh, Surrey, England
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 08-28-2002 05:01 AM      Profile for Bernard Tonks   Email Bernard Tonks   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hammerite is the nearest product that I know of, that has the toughness of oven baked enamel. A half pint size (500ml) tin would be sufficient to do at least 3 projector & soundheads. Shake well and regular stir!


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Sam Hunter
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 779
From: West Monroe, LA, USA
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 08-28-2002 12:03 PM      Profile for Sam Hunter   Email Sam Hunter   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
John,
You back home yet?
I am about to bust open waiting to hear from you.
Well, not really.


------------------
Samuel Hunter Sr.

Death to DLP (Video)


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Randy Loy
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 156

Registered: Aug 1999


 - posted 08-28-2002 02:56 PM      Profile for Randy Loy   Email Randy Loy   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks everybody for the great advice. I really appreciate it.

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Barry Floyd
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1079
From: Lebanon, Tennessee, USA
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 08-28-2002 03:45 PM      Profile for Barry Floyd   Author's Homepage   Email Barry Floyd   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Not to sound completely moronic, but when baking the wrinkle finsh paint in the oven, I'm assuming that everything that will come off or apart needs to be stripped from the projector. Before I go sticking my XL in my wife's oven... I might want to know. What's the best weay to remove the oil thats soaked into the aluminum castings?

Also, is there any difference "heat-wise" when it comes to what color you should repaint the machine? I have no idea what year my XL is, but I know it had been at the drive-in where I got it for quite a while.

Here's what the projector looked like the day I bought it.

------------------
Barry Floyd
Floyd Entertainment Group
Lebanon, Tennessee

Stardust Drive-In Theatre
Watertown, Tennessee

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Steve Kraus
Film God

Posts: 4094
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Registered: May 2000


 - posted 08-28-2002 06:22 PM      Profile for Steve Kraus     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I can see doing a wrinkle finish to be authentic on vintage gear but why did this finish come into being in the first place? It's harder to keep clean in an oily environment.

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Will Kutler
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1506
From: Tucson, AZ, USA
Registered: Feb 2001


 - posted 08-28-2002 08:55 PM      Profile for Will Kutler   Email Will Kutler   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Remember that zinc based primer should be used on non-ferrous parts. Ace Hardware has a zinc based primer in their brand.

Hammerite or Hammertone is symply a paint that cures with a ball peined hammer type look. There are several brands of paints w/a hammered finish. Once again, check Ace Hardware.

Personally, I cannot stand black wrinkled finishes. Too hard to clean and inspect for dirt...it is not practical.

I am currently repainting my Supers, Sh1000s and E7.

Paints of choice: Zinc primer on non-ferrous surfaces;

Dupli-Color High Temp (oil, gas, grease resistant) engine ceramic based paints. Color of choice is New Ford Grey and White sanded and rubbed between coats. And it is really comming out nice. Resembles the color of grey used on most industrial equipment.

When using zinc primers, only a very light coat is needed. Also pay strong attention to your brand of paint's instructions. Many of todays paints are not meant for numerous coats as they might not be able to vapor vent and will not cure! Also, if your manufacturer says to wait a given period of time between coats, then do it...or unwanted things can happen!

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Sam Hunter
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 779
From: West Monroe, LA, USA
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 08-28-2002 09:36 PM      Profile for Sam Hunter   Email Sam Hunter   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I was thinking Chevy Orange for my project.
Well, maybe not.
If I was to ever decide to rebuild my stuff I would aim to get it back as close to "Factory" as I can get.

------------------
Samuel Hunter Sr.

Death to DLP (Video)

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