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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » Theatre Staff projectionist Sucks! (Page 1)

 
This topic comprises 3 pages: 1  2  3 
 
Author Topic: Theatre Staff projectionist Sucks!
Claude S. Ayakawa
Film God

Posts: 2738
From: Waipahu, Hawaii, USA
Registered: Aug 2002


 - posted 08-12-2002 02:26 AM      Profile for Claude S. Ayakawa   Author's Homepage   Email Claude S. Ayakawa   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I was looking forward to "SIGNS" since I first heard of the movie and saw the trailer for the first time and made up my mind to see it in the best theatre when it opens in Hawaii. I opened here two weeks ago with the rest of the nation and my favorite theatre, the Waikiki Twins was one of the venues playing the movie. For those of you who are not familiar with the Waikiki Twins, each of the two auditorium can accommodate a little under a thousand people and they both have a 60 foot screen. The two auditoriums are capable of playing films in 35mm and 70mm and it was a pleasure to see a lot of large format films in these houses. Theatre #1 is only set up with SDDS-8 with a Dolby EX unit and Theatre #2 has both SRD and SDDS-8 with Dolby EX. Both of the auditoriums features John Allen's top of the line XL class HPS-4000 sound systems and they are awesome.

Until recently Consolidated Theatres (Pacific) had two professional projectionist working at the theatres including Film Tech member Chris Siu but I just learned from my friend Alan Sakaida, Pacific's sight and sound head technician that the Twins now have management personal in the booth running the show at all times. The presentations at the WAikiki has always been flawless until today. The pre show advertisments and the analogue poicy trailer sounded flat with no surround but I had no problem with that but I was shocked when the SDDS digital sound and all of the movie trailers with digital tracks also played with no sound coming from the surround speakers. I immediately complained but nothing was done with the surround sound until the movie was half over. What little I heard when the surrounds featuring Dolby EX kicked in sounded great especially when the alien (s) was breaking into the house. I stayed to watch the trailers and the first 15 minutes of "SIGNS" again at the next show and the presentation this time was flawless and everything sounded great! It was unfortunate that my timing was bad and I had to sit through a sub standard performance because an unskilled person was in the booth

It is very sad to see a wonderful theatre fall victim to cooperate greed and play their films in a unprofessional manner. If this trand continues, I think I will upgrade my picture and sound and watch all my movies at home. When I do, it will include a 16 X 9 High definition projection screen and the best sound system featuring both Dolby EX and DTS ES. I have a great system now but if I plan to see all of my movies at home instead of a theatre, I want to get the best equipment I can afford.

-Claude


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Antonio Marcheselli
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1260
From: Florence, Italy
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 08-12-2002 05:53 AM      Profile for Antonio Marcheselli   Author's Homepage   Email Antonio Marcheselli   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Claude,

Your story is sad, but it is what's happen every time I go to the theater in my town. Sound devices are often left to their destiny (I saw a 6 screen multiplex with CP500 and SA-10 with no projectionist in the booth: who select EX or no-ex???) and the result is what you've heard.


It's funny, I too come to your solution: arrange a hi quality setup Home Theater in my house, partially using professional devices.

It's sad, but sometimes it is the only thing that a real "moviegoer" can do.

Bye

------------------
Antonio Marcheselli
Florence, Italy

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Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 08-12-2002 06:13 AM      Profile for Scott Norwood   Author's Homepage   Email Scott Norwood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Isn't DTS-ES the same thing (conceptually) as Dolby EX?

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99


 - posted 08-12-2002 08:41 AM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
Sounds to me like the automation didn't cue something and it ended up in analog. Or possibly the operator did not properly thread the digital reader and it couldn't track. But even the analog should have been pretty good. Someone may have knocked the A-chain out of alignment. Unfortunately this is what happens when projectionists have to do "double duty" as manager or usher. The booth runs unattended and if something misses a cue, no one knows about it.


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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 08-12-2002 08:49 AM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Claude: Certainly, anyone encountering poor presentation should immediately inform the theatre personnel (as you did), so hopefully the problem can be addressed immediately.

For persistent or chronic problems, it is also important to document the problem in writing, not only to the local theatre management, but to the circuit management.

Here is contact information for the major theatre circuits:
http://www.boxoffice.com/giantstop.html
http://www.boxoffice.com/issues/jul00/canada.html
http://www.boxoffice.com/issues/jul00/europe.html
http://www.boxoffice.com/issues/dec99/asia3.html
http://www.boxoffice.com/shows/cinemaexpo/2002/european_giants.html

In general, the VP of Projection/Engineering, or VP of Operations should be copied on any report of chronic problems.

Often it is a tug-of-war between the "bean counters" and the technical people within a circuit. Documentation of problems stemming from poorly choosen cost-cutting methods will help the technical people fight for "Film Done Right".

I agree with you that theatres risk losing much of their audience to home theatre unless they have "Film/Digital Done Right".

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: +1 585 477 5325 Cell: +1 585 781 4036 Fax: +1 585 722 7243
e-mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion


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Paul Cassidy
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 549
From: Auckland, New Zealand
Registered: Aug 2001


 - posted 08-12-2002 09:14 AM      Profile for Paul Cassidy   Author's Homepage   Email Paul Cassidy   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Claude the best thing I found to get the message through to some Cinemas is to e-mail the Head Office of the theatre Chain and let them know of your experience , at times when I've griped I thought that no one was listening , but when you put in a good word for one of their theatres it seems to be made public , so while they may remain silent on complaints ,they do hear them..... the problem is that most just shrug there shoulders and accept that this is the way it's going to be and do nothing ....When the Good do nothing the Bad Gain Strength .

------------------
A KIWI eats,roots & Leaves.


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Claude S. Ayakawa
Film God

Posts: 2738
From: Waipahu, Hawaii, USA
Registered: Aug 2002


 - posted 08-12-2002 12:21 PM      Profile for Claude S. Ayakawa   Author's Homepage   Email Claude S. Ayakawa   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Scott,

Home Dolby EX is the same as the theatre version where the rear surround sound is achieved by matrix of the right and left discreet surround tracks. Home DTS-ES is a full 6.1 discreet process without the use of matrix. Also, I have found that while Dolby digital sounds great in my home theatre, I feel that DTS is better most of the time in my humble opinion.

-Claude

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Paul Linfesty
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1383
From: Bakersfield, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 1999


 - posted 08-12-2002 12:38 PM      Profile for Paul Linfesty   Email Paul Linfesty   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Claude

While DTS does have a discrete version of their DTS-ES format for the home, VERY few (less than 5 titles, I believe) DVD movies utilize this. By far most of the DTS-ES titles on DVD use the same matrixed version that is utilized in the original 6.1 Dolby Digital EX mix. All it does is use DTS's decoders to pull out the rear information from the Left and right surround tracks. Scott is right, there is no conceptual diofference.

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Claude S. Ayakawa
Film God

Posts: 2738
From: Waipahu, Hawaii, USA
Registered: Aug 2002


 - posted 08-12-2002 01:07 PM      Profile for Claude S. Ayakawa   Author's Homepage   Email Claude S. Ayakawa   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
John & Paul,

I did the next best thing when I sent an email to Alan Sakaida last night and asked him to let the local CEO at Consolidtaed Theatres read my Film Tech post and suggested Mr Yim to alert Consolidated's head office(Pacific Theatres) in Los Angeles to also read it. Let us hope that the people at the head office will read my comments I had posted about the Waikiki #2 poor sound presentation here at Film Tech and will make every effort to make sure that everyone who works in their booths are fully qualified and know what they are doing and what had happened yesterday will not happen again..

-Claude


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Antonio Marcheselli
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1260
From: Florence, Italy
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 08-12-2002 01:14 PM      Profile for Antonio Marcheselli   Author's Homepage   Email Antonio Marcheselli   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
John,

Do you really think that inform the management can solve the situation? Yes, "double-duty" personnel will left unattended the booth. But in my experience managers often do not care about the presentation. I know a very well equipped theater in my town. Biggest screen has SDDS-8, DTS, DD, EX, triamp. The projectionist told me that once he come to the manager asking him a tech because one of the digital player was faulty. He replied "no, it is not possibile". The projectionist replied with the problems encountered. The manager replied "no matter, use analog".
So I wonder "why he installed all of that stuff???".

I understand that management is the straight line to hit the point but, unfortunately, sometimes the best solution is to build our own home theater!

Bye

------------------
Antonio Marcheselli
Florence, Italy

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 08-12-2002 01:39 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Antonio:

As I noted, there is often a "tug-of-war" between those who want to cut costs regardless of the effect on quality, and those who really want to have good presentation. When cost-cutting measures result in chronic poor presentation, written customer feedback is one of the most useful tools those in charge of projection can use to get adequate funding.

Likewise, customer feedback is helpful in identifying those theatres that have chronic presentation problems needing attention from upper management.

Not reporting problems and retreating to the security of your home theatre does nothing to improve the quality of presentation in theatres, which is the industry we all work in.

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: +1 585 477 5325 Cell: +1 585 781 4036 Fax: +1 585 722 7243
e-mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion

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Christopher Seo
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 530
From: Los Angeles, CA
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 08-12-2002 01:55 PM      Profile for Christopher Seo   Email Christopher Seo   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Claude,

Yes, the situation is unfortunate. When I was at Waikiki I had a whole list of things to do for each show, different fader settings for each and every snipe, trailer, etc. as well as enabling the EX adapter when and only when the feature started to avoid loading the rear surrounds. None of this could be done via automation; you needed a person in the booth for the first 15 minutes of a show, period. Multiply this by even three screens and that's more time than I think management or staff doing double duty can afford to spend upstairs per set.

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Paul Linfesty
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1383
From: Bakersfield, CA, USA
Registered: Nov 1999


 - posted 08-12-2002 03:02 PM      Profile for Paul Linfesty   Email Paul Linfesty   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
My experience with Pacific Theatres has been mixed. I wrote a letter to corporate in Los Angeles about the Bakersfield theatres. Conditions dramatically changed...for a while.

But now things are back to the way they were. I definitely say you cannot just report to the local manager. I've done that. It does no good. Windows are back to being badly streaked (one showing a viewed recently loked like a fourth of the lens was smeared with vaseline, but when looking at the porhole it was the glass). Digital readers are not threaded up. This staff just doesn't care. So no more Pacific theatres for me. At least not in Bakersfield.

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Claude S. Ayakawa
Film God

Posts: 2738
From: Waipahu, Hawaii, USA
Registered: Aug 2002


 - posted 08-12-2002 03:15 PM      Profile for Claude S. Ayakawa   Author's Homepage   Email Claude S. Ayakawa   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
John & Antonio,
I believe I was the only person to complain about the sound yesterday at the Waikiki Twins. It is a sad fact that the people who complain the most about poor sound presentation are "Movie Geeks" and Cinema professionals like us who post here at Film Tech. Unfortunately, we are in a small minority group and theatres owners know this and the likelihood that they will do anything about it is nil no matter how many times we complain. On another topic, did you ever notice that more DVD's now are being released in both full screen and original aspect ratio versions with many in full screen only? This is due to the public complaining that they do not like the black bars on the top and bottom of their TV screens. It is a sad fact that many people will complain about how the picture looks but will say nothing about the sound. This is the reason why most people are satisfied with the mono or pseuo stereo that came with their set. While a lot of people now have 5.1 sound in their homes, we are still a small minority group and will remain so because most people are not interested in good sound.

Chris,

It is very obvious from what you said that the operator who worked at the booth yesterday at the Waikiki Twins did not know or care about how to run films properly at these magnificent theatres. The only people I can fault is the management at Pacific Theatre's head office who seem to be more interested in making a profit than their customers getting their monies worth from an outstanding presentation in both picture and sound when they replaced their professional operators with staff people.

-Claude


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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 08-12-2002 03:35 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Claude said: "It is a sad fact that the people who complain the most about poor sound presentation are "Movie Geeks" and Cinema professionals like us who post here at Film Tech. Unfortunately, we are in a small minority group."

That is exactly why it is so important for us to speak out when we encounter bad presentation. If we don't write about problems, upper management only hears of problems when passes are given out, and even then, assumes that's all it takes to "solve" the problems. If the audience ultimately goes to other theatres or stays home because of presentation problems, upper management may not make the connection and leave the problems unresolved.

Take pride in your expertise and being a "cinema professional" and let theatres and their management know when they fail your expectations.

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: +1 585 477 5325 Cell: +1 585 781 4036 Fax: +1 585 722 7243
e-mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion

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