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Topic: Will Filmguard crack plastic rollers?

Jan Hackett
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 148
From: Albuquerque, NM, USA
Registered: Apr 2002

posted 06-10-2002 02:10 PM

A tech told me to watch my rollers for cracking with film guard? Is this true?

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Jan Hackett
Theater Operations Manager
Extreme Screen Dynatheater
NM Museum of Natural History Foundation

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Jeff Taylor
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 601
From: Chatham, NJ/East Hampton, NY
Registered: Apr 2000

posted 06-10-2002 02:18 PM

I've NEVER seen one crack with Film-Guard, but they sure look clean (as does everything else it comes in contact with). I think a lot of otherwise knowledgable operators / techs confuse Film-Guard with any number of other products, some of which are fairly noxious, and never bother to learn the truth.

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99

posted 06-10-2002 02:57 PM

No it won't crack your plastic rollers. Like Jeff said, he is probably just mistaking FilmGuard for something else.

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Dave Williams
Wet nipple scene

Posts: 1836
From: Salt Lake City, UT, USA
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 06-10-2002 03:55 PM

If anyone tells you anything bad about film guard, just remember one simple rule...

...BRAD IS A FILM GOD!!!

I have heard so many negatives about the stuff from people who have never used it. When you show it to em, they freak and become loyal subjects.

Dave

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Paul G. Thompson
The Weenie Man

Posts: 4718
From: Mount Vernon WA USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 06-10-2002 06:32 PM

I have not found anything that was damaged by Film-Guard. It won't even dissolve paint in my spray-bombed XL's.

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99

posted 06-10-2002 07:05 PM

I used it to take some black magic marker marks off our linoleum floor.

When we got new seats recently, the installers used a grease pencil to mark the floor. FG took that off as well.

Also works to remove pesky adhesive from stickers, cheap splicing tape, etc.

And, it does a pretty good job on film too!

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99

posted 06-10-2002 08:32 PM

If Filmguard cracked plastic wouldn't the plastic cores that come WITH Filmguard be history???!!

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Jan Hackett
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 148
From: Albuquerque, NM, USA
Registered: Apr 2002

posted 06-10-2002 09:13 PM

I thought along those lines. Tech must have thought I was using cineclean.........

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Jan Hackett
Theater Operations Manager
Extreme Screen Dynatheater
NM Museum of Natural History Foundation

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Greg Mueller
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1687
From: Port Gamble, WA
Registered: Jun 99

posted 06-10-2002 09:29 PM

I use it regularly in a DP70 and it doesn't hurt whatever those rollers are made from.

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Greg Mueller
Amateur Astronomer, Machinist, Filmnut
http://www.muellersatomics.com/

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Randy Stankey
Film God

Posts: 6539
From: Erie, Pennsylvania
Registered: Jun 99

posted 06-10-2002 10:00 PM

Not only are the film cores made from plastic but the film itself is plastic! If FilmGuard was going to damage plastic it would damage the film, wouldn't it?

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John Hawkinson
Film God

Posts: 2273
From: Cambridge, MA, USA
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 06-11-2002 09:14 AM

Randy,
That's not a good assumption to make. There are hundreds [thousands?] of types of plastic, and what damages one may not damage another.
I know you were mostly being tongue-in-cheek, but it seems worth clarifying, "for the record."

--jhawk

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 06-11-2002 09:27 AM

One test for the effect of solvents on materials is to soak a sample of the plastic (roller, core, film, or whatever) in the solvent for several days, and see if the plastic is softened, dissolved, or made more brittle.

For film, wrap about a meter (3 feet) of the film into a tight roll and put it in one of the polyethylene "snap-top" film containers that 35mm still film cartridges are packaged in. Fill the container with the solvent being tested, and incubate the film sample. After a few days, remove the film sample and observe whether the solvent had any adverse effect on the film, such as stickiness, excessive curl, change in surface gloss, dyes being leached out, etc.

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John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: +1 585 477 5325 Cell: +1 585 781 4036 Fax: +1 585 722 7243
e-mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99

posted 06-11-2002 12:52 PM

John, that's really not a good test for film, for Joe tried that a couple of years back with some products like Johnson's Paste Wax and I tried it with VitaFilm many years ago with a couple of others. The trailer core dissolved into Play-Dough and the film turned into a mucky, nasty blob of goo from the wax alone. Film does not like being torture treated like that. That is why there are directions for application on every kind of solvent. If a solvent was designed to have the film submerged into it, then that would be in the directions. If the solvent was not designed for that kind of application, then the film should not be treated like that. Specifically speaking, FilmGuard is pretty concentrated and a quart will clean more film than a gallon of any other cleaner.

An extreme example, but one that should make my point...to make sure a roll of film is really "safety film", one should take an entire roll and sit it on a lit barbeque grill for several days? Of course not!

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 06-11-2002 01:01 PM

The "torture test" is used because film may accidently be wound up wet with the solvent and be exposed to the solvent for a long time. If soaking seems too extreme, then just treat the film with the solvent and wind it up slightly wet before incubation.

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99

posted 06-11-2002 01:10 PM

Now that's a better way of testing things, and one I have always followed. The idea being to overapply the solution to the film past recommendations and then store it. While soaking may work ok to simulate an "overapplication" on some cleaners, it will just be too much for others. Still the original question was concerning rollers and the answer is still no. I know theaters who have used FilmGuard to clean their rollers, rather than the commonly used alcohol and such and there are no adverse effects. Remember the solution has been in various stages of testing for about 13 years now. I think I would have noticed something during that time.

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