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» Film-Tech Forum   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » EQ curve (Page 1)

 
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Author Topic: EQ curve
Antonio Marcheselli
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1260
From: Florence, Italy
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 04-22-2002 01:53 PM      Profile for Antonio Marcheselli   Author's Homepage   Email Antonio Marcheselli   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi everyone,

I need to know the correct curve to equalize stage channels. I need to know where the freq. response start to drop and how much.

Thanks!

Antonio

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Manny Knowles
"What are these things and WHY are they BLUE???"

Posts: 4247
From: Bloomington, IN, USA
Registered: Feb 2002


 - posted 04-22-2002 02:08 PM      Profile for Manny Knowles   Email Manny Knowles   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hmm...I was taught to go for as flat a response as possible (but without "over-EQ-ing").

------------------
And, hey! Let's be careful out there.

~Manny.


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Antonio Marcheselli
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1260
From: Florence, Italy
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 04-22-2002 02:17 PM      Profile for Antonio Marcheselli   Author's Homepage   Email Antonio Marcheselli   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I knew that there is a specific curve to follow and that the "flat" response was referred to that curve.

Antonio

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17664
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99


 - posted 04-22-2002 02:50 PM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
20hz to 2Khz flat, then down 3db per octave up to 20Khz.

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David Stambaugh
Film God

Posts: 4016
From: Eugene, Oregon
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 04-22-2002 02:55 PM      Profile for David Stambaugh   Author's Homepage   Email David Stambaugh   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Stupid newbie question: Why the rolloff at upper frequencies? I would think that since the speakers are behind a perforated screen, which will affect the response, you would maybe want a boost instead of rolloff to compensate for high frequency loss. ?? Is what you're referring to called the "B Curve" or something like that? If a theater is following THX guidelines, is the desired response curve the same (I could probably look that last one up myself)? Sorry, enquiring minds want to know.

[well, I knew it was the "some letter" curve]


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Gordon McLeod
Film God

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From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 04-22-2002 04:34 PM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Back a long time ago Bell Labs discovered in a large room the electrical acoustic curve to playback of music compared to the live event in the same room had a roll off to it
In a large room it worked out over the years to being flat to 2K and then rolling off 3 db per ocatve. In smaller rooms less roll off and in gigantic rooms more roll off. This is also related to the reverberation time and we will not go there here
Despite what some claim the X curve as it is now referred to is an ISO standard

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John Pytlak
Film God

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From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
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 - posted 04-22-2002 04:37 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The pertinent standard is SMPTE 214M-1999:
http://www.smpte.org/smpte_store/standards/index.cfm?scope=1&stdtype=smpte&CurrentPage=8

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: +1 585 477 5325 Cell: +1 585 781 4036 Fax: +1 585 722 7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion

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David Stambaugh
Film God

Posts: 4016
From: Eugene, Oregon
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 04-22-2002 04:58 PM      Profile for David Stambaugh   Author's Homepage   Email David Stambaugh   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Interesting. "SMPTE 214M-1999: for Motion-Picture Film (35-mm) - Photographic Audio Reproduction Characteristics. This standard specifies the electrical frequency response characteristics for photographic audio reproduction in motion-picture control rooms and indoor theaters."

Does that refer only to optical soundtracks? Does digital follow the same specs? Mag? Just wondering, since the spec specifically identifies optical playback. Unless they mean "photographic" in the more broad sense of the word, like movie sound in general.


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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
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 - posted 04-22-2002 05:18 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
There are separate SMPTE Standards for magnetic sound.

e.g., SMPTE 208M, SMPTE 217, etc.

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: +1 585 477 5325 Cell: +1 585 781 4036 Fax: +1 585 722 7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion

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Antonio Marcheselli
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1260
From: Florence, Italy
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 04-22-2002 05:30 PM      Profile for Antonio Marcheselli   Author's Homepage   Email Antonio Marcheselli   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Brad

20 to 2000????

I always saw flat to 12.000

Today is the day of news...

Bye
A

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

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From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 04-22-2002 06:19 PM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
John that standard I believe is the A chain standard for optical and there is a mag one as well as it specifies up to the main fader the room accoustic response is after that
the x curve is ISO2969

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David Stambaugh
Film God

Posts: 4016
From: Eugene, Oregon
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 04-22-2002 06:37 PM      Profile for David Stambaugh   Author's Homepage   Email David Stambaugh   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Did some searching, found some info on ISO 2969. It's based on psycho-acoustic testing of human hearing in near and far soundfield situations. Applies only to large venues such as movie theaters. It rolls of the high frequencies as Brad and Gordon said. (Not that they need me to confirm what they said )

THX seems to take issue with the ISO 2969 curve, but it isn't clear from what I read whether they're talking about THX re-eq'ing in a commercial theater, or in a home theater.


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Antonio Marcheselli
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1260
From: Florence, Italy
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 04-22-2002 06:38 PM      Profile for Antonio Marcheselli   Author's Homepage   Email Antonio Marcheselli   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Brad,

Ignore my previous message.
Ok, flat to 2k.
But about the 20hz... I saw on CP500 that frequencies should start to drop at 50Hz.

Who is right?

Bye
Antonio

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

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From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 04-22-2002 07:42 PM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
THX supports the ISO curve for comercial theatres

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David Stambaugh
Film God

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From: Eugene, Oregon
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 04-22-2002 07:51 PM      Profile for David Stambaugh   Author's Homepage   Email David Stambaugh   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Based on the difference in sound at the theaters here, seems like one of them has to be deviating from the X curve. Cinemark's screens all sound like the high frequencies are rolled off. They are not crisp and they lack detail. Regal on the other hand sounds very crisp and has more detail. These 2 locations are very different. Wonder which one is more correct. The Regal theater was originally THX-certified but that was dropped a few years ago.


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