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Author Topic: DTS ES discs
Miguel Angel Martorell
Film Handler

Posts: 81
From: Valencia, Spain
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 01-26-2002 09:55 PM      Profile for Miguel Angel Martorell   Email Miguel Angel Martorell   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
In all the DTS discs that Iīve seen of the recent releases there is no reference about the ES (6.1 channels). There is any visible difference between the DTS and DTS ES discs.
The same happens with DD EX. Since it came only one print advertised in the reel boxes that it was recorded in this format. The film was Star Wars:The phamtom menace. Since then, none.
It happens the same in the rest of Europe? īcause I think in the States you wonīt have this problem.
Thanks

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Antonio Marcheselli
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1260
From: Florence, Italy
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 01-27-2002 05:21 AM      Profile for Antonio Marcheselli   Author's Homepage   Email Antonio Marcheselli   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Miguel,

Seems that EX print will be never be advertised. I think that the best think is to go on www.dolby.com or www.dtsonline.com (remember that when one movie is DD-EX encoded it will be also the DTS-ES version).
In Italy I never found any sticker or something telling us if it is EX or not. I've projected Star Wars and my copy didn't have any advise.
The problem is that the only theater that, at that time, has EX, asked for a change because "our copy is not EX recorded".

Wait... Do you have DTS ES decoder? I heard that DTS ES connected to DTS player will activate itself automatically IF the movie is ES encoded...

Karen, I believe that to do that there is a "bit" in the digital data that tell to DTS-ES that is time to turn on, right?
So, at the moment of encoding you know that the soundtrack is in ES. So why don't you put something on the disk itself? It will help who has SA-10 with DTS. And you will demonstrate more "attention" than Dolby...
It could be helpful to find "es" beside the title of the movie. Like:
"Star Wars - ES"

Bye
Antonio

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Miguel Angel Martorell
Film Handler

Posts: 81
From: Valencia, Spain
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 01-27-2002 08:17 AM      Profile for Miguel Angel Martorell   Email Miguel Angel Martorell   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Antonio. Thanks for your answer but the fact is that I havenīt got any ES or EX procesor.
I donīt know how works the DTS ES but in a newly opened megaplex with DD EX in all its screens they said me that the processor dontīs change to EX automatically if thereīs an especific EX track so they select EX on all the presentations and as the said me "if thereīs no EX track, the processor simulates one".
I donīt know what to think about it.
If Karen do you read this, does the DTS ES discs advertised on the written side of the disc or are just the same as the common DTS discs?
Thanks.

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Antonio Marcheselli
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1260
From: Florence, Italy
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 01-27-2002 12:13 PM      Profile for Antonio Marcheselli   Author's Homepage   Email Antonio Marcheselli   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Miguel,

Does the new multiplex has CP650 or CP500? I know that CP650 will switch in EX (if installed) automatically. CP500 has to be manually (or via automation) selected.

EX/ES works in a very simple mode: a Dolby Stereo matrix code is applied to Surround Left and Surround Right during recording to put a Back Surround channel. Then a normal Dolby Stereo decoder will elaborate the LS/RS signal to "re-create" the back surround channel. The SA10 from dolby (the dolby unit for EX decoding) is just a modified CP45. The main difference is that a regular Dolby Stereo soundtrack will have 4 channel from a source of 2 channels; an EX decoder will decode 3 channel from 2. (like the center channel!).

If you play a NON EX soundtrack with the EX decoder activated, there will be a Dolby decoding in a non dolby encoded soundtrack. Like playing a Mono print with a Dolby SR decoder: it will be different than the director has intended it!

DTS-ES will change from "normal" to "ES" automatically instead.

Tell to your friend at multiplex that (if they have CP500):
1. Upgrade the Cp500 to last version, "1.61 EX". With that software version, if I remember correctly, a Dolby Digital on SK8 will automatically turn on the SA-10. So they'll have to set their automation to pulse the Cp500 to SK8 at film start.

Hope that this can help you. I believe that we understand better each other if I write in Italian and you write in Spanish...

Bye
Antonio

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99


 - posted 01-27-2002 03:02 PM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
I'm not sure if this is what you are asking, but if you are playing back in SRD and using a DTS ES decoder, there is no "built in" automation. Same if you are playing back in DTS and using an SRD EX decoder. The only way is for your tech to specially wire it to be automated.

Note: this info may be outdated, for I seem to remember hearing that Dolby was working on something that would auto-detect the presence of EX.

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Antonio Marcheselli
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1260
From: Florence, Italy
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 01-28-2002 05:04 AM      Profile for Antonio Marcheselli   Author's Homepage   Email Antonio Marcheselli   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Brad, you're right.

I know that to have ES automatically switch, you should hav a DTS player plus a DTS-ES decoder. You'll have back surround also with DTS+SA-10 but not automatically.

Doesn't CP650 will automatically recognize Dolby EX???

Bye
Antonio

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Miguel Angel Martorell
Film Handler

Posts: 81
From: Valencia, Spain
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 01-28-2002 07:58 AM      Profile for Miguel Angel Martorell   Email Miguel Angel Martorell   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hi Antonio and others. As they tell me in the megaplex the cp650 doesnīt switch automatically to EX.
Un saludo

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Karen Hultgren
Master Film Handler

Posts: 492
From: Agoura Hills, CA, USA
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 01-28-2002 02:09 PM      Profile for Karen Hultgren   Author's Homepage   Email Karen Hultgren   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Yes, you can tell by the movie's serial number printed on the disc. Four digits is a 5.1 disc and five digits is ES.

Karen at DTS

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Antonio Marcheselli
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1260
From: Florence, Italy
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 01-28-2002 02:22 PM      Profile for Antonio Marcheselli   Author's Homepage   Email Antonio Marcheselli   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Miguel,

Another reason to buy DTS decoder...

Karen,

Fantastic!!! I didn't know.

Bye
Antonio

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John Wilson
Film God

Posts: 5438
From: Sydney, Australia.
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 01-28-2002 06:39 PM      Profile for John Wilson   Email John Wilson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The 650 has the capability to auto detect. Some Dolby Digital Aurora tags have the coding on them but only the very new copies. Auto detect coding is being added to feature prints early this year.

Did you say that ALL screens in that complex had EX? Are you sure?

John

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Miguel Angel Martorell
Film Handler

Posts: 81
From: Valencia, Spain
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 01-28-2002 08:27 PM      Profile for Miguel Angel Martorell   Email Miguel Angel Martorell   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Thanks Karen now we have to change the mind of our boss in order to buy the DTS ES adpater.


John, when I heard that for 1st time I didnīt belived. 24 screens all with THX and DD EX???, no way.
But the people there is very nice and I asked for a visit of the booth and I had to eat my words. The 24 screen are equipped with Dolby CP650 with EX adaptor (I donīt remember the model. DA10?? and a new THX net crossover (is that the name?)that I suppouse is the next model from the old fashioned black box that I have in my THX screen.
Cinemeccanica Victoria 5 and CNR 3-35 platters and Decatron built-in set rectifier, lamphouse and automation system.
The megaplex is called Kinepolis Paterna (www.kinepolis.com) and I have to recognize that if I had to pay to watch movies it will be my first choice but...they are the enemy.
Saludos

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Antonio Marcheselli
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1260
From: Florence, Italy
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 01-29-2002 04:30 AM      Profile for Antonio Marcheselli   Author's Homepage   Email Antonio Marcheselli   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Miguel,

It is strange that at Kinepolis there are CP650+ SA-10 (the surround ex adapter from dolby) since CP650 has an add-on card to have EX.

DTS ES is better not only because it switches automatically in ES.
I heard that DTS-ES adaptor has two different equalization: one for "normal mode" and one for "ES mode". So maximum quality is offered for each show.

Dolby one is just an old CP45 refusbished. And has ony one equalization.

DTS is cheaper and, like dolby one, works with Dolby Digital and SDDS.

So, why I never saw any DTS-ES????

Bye
Antonio

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99


 - posted 01-29-2002 04:35 AM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
Dolby SA10 works with dts and sdds too. That's nothing special.

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Antonio Marcheselli
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1260
From: Florence, Italy
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 01-29-2002 02:14 PM      Profile for Antonio Marcheselli   Author's Homepage   Email Antonio Marcheselli   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Brad,

Isn't what I said?

Nothing special? I know a theater manager that buoght SA-10 for Star Wars and not DTS-ES because "there are more DD-ex title than DTS-ES ones".
Once I told him that he can have back surround with their SA-10 also with DTS sound and he told me "no, if I use sa-10 with DTS I'll never have the back surround".

Karen, I believe that DTS should advertise better their products...

Bye
Antonio

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John Wilson
Film God

Posts: 5438
From: Sydney, Australia.
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 01-29-2002 04:57 PM      Profile for John Wilson   Email John Wilson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Do Dolby make a snipe that actually says 'EX'? I'd buy some of them for our two largest screens. Of course, Hoyts, Village and Greater Union in Sydney could too but that would be pointless...

they have NO EX. Not a single one in how many screens?

A lot anyway.

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