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Author Topic: Strange projection story
Andy Davis
Film Handler

Posts: 49
From: Gainesville, FL
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 04-11-2000 07:39 PM      Profile for Andy Davis   Author's Homepage   Email Andy Davis   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I was doing a routine xenon lamp change (picture dim, flickering)today and to my surprise, the lamphouse (ORC) hand douser was laying in the reflector, against the xenon lamp! My first reaction was "DAAAAMMMMNNNN!!!!!" and I didn't understand why there wasn't a pile of broken glass laying in the lamphouse. When I pulled it out, I noticed some marking on the glass of the xenon lamp from where the douser hit it, but the reflector was unscratched. I found out that a couple of months ago, a projectionist tried to close the hand douser and the handle broke off. The douser itself fell down into the reflector and landed on the xenon lamp. He didn't tell anybody what happened and nobody seemed to notice since the hand douser is rarely used. The on-screen presentation was just a little dim, despite having a large piece of metal stuck in the reflector. This is probably the strangest thing I've ever witnessed in the booth. Anybody else have any strange stories like this?

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John Walsh
Film God

Posts: 2490
From: Connecticut, USA, Earth, Milky Way
Registered: Oct 1999


 - posted 04-11-2000 09:38 PM      Profile for John Walsh   Email John Walsh   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
A long story- but it's late and some people like details.......

A theater I worked at had an old RCA 35/70 magnetic sound system installed in 1961 for, "West Side Story." In this setup, they put two electrical boxes, one above the other, on the left side of the booth on the front wall. Each box had a long steel rod with levers on it that went across the front wall of the booth, just above the port windows. One box controlled the volume, and the other did the mag sound changover. So, there was only one electrical control that could be operated from either projector. If you wanted to make a mag c/o, you would put your foot on a floor pedal and your right hand on the lever above your head and spin it up (for #1) or down (for #2.)

There was a third box high up on the wall that was the high voltage power supply for the amplifier tubes in the racks below. All these boxes had "MI-XXXXX" numbers on them.

The previous operator had told me that if you let the upper magazine door on projector 2 open all the way, it would touch one of the rods and cause a 60hz hum in the sound system. He said several Altec people had looked at it over the years, and could not fix it.

I started working there in 1978 or so and it looked like 18 years of various kinds of tape had been stuck to the door and the rod. There were bits of friction tape, duct tape, masking tape, transparent tape, with a strange gooey mess all around.

In 1980, after running, "SW: Empire" in 70mm, it was decided to twin the theater. All the RCA stuff was to be thrown out. The owners asked me to do a nice job removing it because they thought they would sell it (Ha-ha! They ended up paying someone a lot to haul it away.)

The first thing I did was get ready to remove the third power supply box. I opened it up and saw a terminal strip. One terminal was clearly labeled, "AC HOT" with a white wire connected to it. Next to it was, "NET" with a black wire.

I thought; I wonder if..... and I reversed them. I powered on the system one last time and made the door electrically touch. The hum was gone.

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Alan Brandt
Film Handler

Posts: 28
From: Salem, Ohio, USA
Registered: Apr 2000


 - posted 04-11-2000 10:48 PM      Profile for Alan Brandt     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
At my theater, some bozo-dorkbutt manager decided to have us replace a bulb mid-show. His reasoning was because he didn't like the way the picture looked on the screen that show. I thought he was bein' a crazy-ol-bastard, but he was quite serious. Since general policy is to only change bulbs when there is a problem with them, or when they expire, I needed a reason to replace a bulb midshow. It was then that my co-worker decided to squirt liquid air inside the lamphouse WHILE IT WAS ON!!

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George Roher
Master Film Handler

Posts: 266
From: Washington DC
Registered: Jul 99


 - posted 04-11-2000 11:43 PM      Profile for George Roher   Email George Roher   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Here's something that's very strange. A nice old single screen theatre here in DC is being converted into a twin by it's new owners. What's strange about that? Check out how they're doing it:
http://www.visionsdc.com/theplans/index.shtml

They are cutting the booth in half to add a balcony to the larger theatre (this place had no balcony originally). The projectors and a five deck platter will be squeezed into what's left of the booth and the image will be shooting out to the screen at an insane angle, especially for the larger house. They are really going to run movies like this!

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99


 - posted 04-12-2000 12:55 AM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
I say to hell with the balcony. Apparently presentation is not #1 on their adjenda. I'll bet those subtitled art films will look especially wonderful there.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 04-12-2000 01:51 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Theatre architects today seem blissfully unaware of keystone distortion, be it with high rake stadium seating, or this (to put it kindly) "unconventional design".

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com

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Dwayne Caldwell
Master Film Handler

Posts: 323
From: Rockwall, TX, USA
Registered: Apr 2000


 - posted 04-12-2000 09:17 PM      Profile for Dwayne Caldwell   Email Dwayne Caldwell   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
They're calling this place Visions. They didn't specify that the visions had to be good. I'm wondering if that right side wall that's curved in the smaller house is going to throw off the EQ any. All of the theatre auditoriums I've ever seen are pretty equilateral.

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 04-12-2000 10:57 PM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
What makes you think that they'll EQ? Judging by the design and prioritization of the projection, I doubt they care too much for sound, either.

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Dustin Mitchell
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1865
From: Mondovi, WI, USA
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 04-12-2000 11:41 PM      Profile for Dustin Mitchell   Email Dustin Mitchell   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Or perhaps they are mearly film lovers who are playing out they're dream of owning they're own theater and showing classic movies all the time. Maybe they don't know a whole lot about projection. Maybe someone with some fancy title behind their name (John?) should send them a formal email pointing out some of the flaws of their plan.

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John Walsh
Film God

Posts: 2490
From: Connecticut, USA, Earth, Milky Way
Registered: Oct 1999


 - posted 04-13-2000 10:00 AM      Profile for John Walsh   Email John Walsh   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
That place might not be _too_ bad. I can't read the drawing to see what the throw is, but we did something like that at a theater we used to own. It had a 125ft. throw, and the screen was only 26 ft wide. Not ideal, of course, but it looked OK.

I don't think there are any "real" theater architects left. Of course, theaters today are designed from the candy stand out- and I don't blame them for that. That's what the owners want. But when many of them can't even get things like a port window right, (one guy was going to put ours 5 feet up) You know they just want to make their "statement of architecural art" and have ingored what the building is _for_. The days of Lamb, Eberson, and Slesinger (sp?) are not only long gone, but forgotten. Luckly, SMPTE has many articles by Slesinger, so if someone takes an interest, the're there.

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Paul Mayer
Oh get out of it Melvin, before it pulls you under!

Posts: 3836
From: Albuquerque, NM
Registered: Feb 2000


 - posted 04-13-2000 07:12 PM      Profile for Paul Mayer   Author's Homepage   Email Paul Mayer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It's bad enough that twining of existing theaters gets handled this way, but how about cases where a theater is built that way on purpose? In Las Vegas, Century built several new multiplexes with projection booths that were centered on the auditorium side walls with a pair of machines in each. So in each theater, projection was from a rear corner, with opposite corners being used for every other theater. Of course, no PC collars. Gads!


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John Wilson
Film God

Posts: 5438
From: Sydney, Australia.
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 04-14-2000 02:45 AM      Profile for John Wilson   Email John Wilson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Originally posted by Joe Redifer:
What makes you think that they'll EQ? Judging by the design and prioritization of the projection, I doubt they care too much for sound, either.

Nahh.......

Dobly? We can't spend THAT kind of money after all we apent on our beautiful new balcony. Just take out that port glass and turn up the booth monitor.


------------------
"It's not the years honey, it's the mileage".
Indiana Jones.

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Ari Nordström
Master Film Handler

Posts: 283
From: Göteborg, Sweden
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 04-14-2000 06:05 AM      Profile for Ari Nordström   Email Ari Nordström   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Strange projection story:

I ran an old archive print (I forget which film it was, unfortunately) with lots of cement splices. The reels, six of them as I recall it, were not made up or anything. This was a five change-over show as is the routine where I work. So while one reel was rolling, I was rewinding the previous, edge-inspecting it with my fingers to locate any damage. These prints are often very fragile so inspecting them is a Very Good Thing To Do.

So anyway, I was rewinding and inspecting reel number five while reel six was rolling, when I suddenly felt the print to, well, lose shape and get narrower. I stopped and saw that between two cement splices, about thirty seconds of the reel had split into two 17.5 mm halves. The first splice was halfway broke, but the second was intact.

The really strange thing is that the projector had simply continued running the reel as if nothing had happened. The two halves (of which one was loose!) neatly wound themselves on the takeup. There was sound through the whole incident (I always keep the booth monitor on to spot any trouble as soon as possible). The image on the screen showed no problems, of course, since the split probably occured below the gate, perhaps on the intermittent. No strange sounds warning me that something was wrong came from the projector. No warnings, no symptoms, no nothing, so of course I didn't notice anything until rewinding.

How's that for a strange projection story?

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John Walsh
Film God

Posts: 2490
From: Connecticut, USA, Earth, Milky Way
Registered: Oct 1999


 - posted 04-14-2000 08:23 AM      Profile for John Walsh   Email John Walsh   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Ari, do you use film failsafe detector?

It was a common problem for film to split length-wise when using some failsafe detectors. Usually, but not always, that projector has an automation system. I havn't seen it since the big move to polyster.

So, the split could have started even after the soundhead. I never was able to tell what started it.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 04-14-2000 08:24 AM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Ari:

I've heard of several similar film splitting incidents before. It usually occurs with triacetate film, and the tear usually begins at a splice that partly broke. As you may know, the film is usually under constant tension in the soundhead, and this tension allows a tear to propagate down the center of the film strip, while the film is being supported and transported by the sprocket teeth on each side of the film. In many cases, the failsafe does not detect this tearing, since the film is still running over the sprockets and hasn't actually "broken" in a way that trips the failsafe sensor.

Obviously, the person who last showed the print didn't inspect the film for problems as they wound it back onto shipping reels. I suspect that it was at a theatre that wasn't using platters, and they just took up the print onto shipping reels during the last show, which is evidently when this tear happened. Obviously, the film exchange didn't inspect the print either.

Moral of the story is to ALWAYS inspect a print, feeling the edges with your fingers, before you project it. (As you did ). Even new prints can have a nicked edge or torn lab splice. Used prints are almost never inspected by the film exchange (the distributors refuse to pay for this optional service), so "caveat printor" .

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com

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