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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » MaxiVision 48 (Page 1)

 
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Author Topic: MaxiVision 48
Michael Barry
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 584
From: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Registered: Nov 1999


 - posted 12-13-1999 11:05 AM      Profile for Michael Barry   Email Michael Barry   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Can a prominent film critic have a pivotal role in the future of cinema? Could this be the answer?

Read this article and see for yourself:
http://www.suntimes.com/output/eb-feature/maxi12.html

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Greg Anderson
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 766
From: Ogden Valley, Utah
Registered: Nov 1999


 - posted 12-13-1999 12:18 PM      Profile for Greg Anderson   Author's Homepage   Email Greg Anderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It would be nice if well-respected, powerful filmmakers came to the rescue, but I doubt they will. Ten years ago, both Panavision and Arriflex introduced state-of-the-art 65mm cameras with all the bells and whistles necessary to re-launch the format. Unfortunately, they weren't able to coax the Steven Spielbergs and James Camerons of the world to shoot with 65mm. Instead, we got FAR AND AWAY and HAMLET and some dabbling with 65mm in lesser-known projects.

As much as Steven Spielberg has endorsed the continued use of film instead of digital, I seriously doubt he or any other high-profile filmmaker will choose to shoot with the MaxiVision 48 format. These are business people, after all. Either some accountant will talk them into going digital OR they'll stick to the status quo (35mm at 24 fps) for the forseeable future. Either way, can you imagine Steven Spielberg shooting in a format (MaxiVision 48, for example) which would limit the number of theatres able to show his film... therefor affecting his bottom line? (This is, after all, the man who shot his "Montana" scene from JURASSIC PARK in the California desert simply so that he could save about $300,000. He must have known that the film would make enough money to offset a mere $300,000 for a location which, he admits, would have made the film better!)

While reading the article, I was already wondering if someone had devised a plan for making 24fps prints of films which were originated on MaxiVision 48.

And, while Roger Ebert's article sings the praises of film and MaxiVision 48, I felt the sting of his insult to incompetent projectionists. It's not that I consider myself incompetent (I DO know how to frame the picture... duh!), but I do consider that if ANYTHING goes wrong during a screening, the average customer will remember that for months, even years, and have that overriding suspicion that the guy in the booth doesn't know what he's doing (whether or not it was the projectionist's fault, and whether or not hundreds of flawless screenings happened at that theatre). Roger Ebert's dig at projectionists will not help our P.R. nor will it help to promote the notion that films and their projectionists should stay in the booths at our local megaplexes.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 12-13-1999 03:22 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
AFAIK, one of the reasons that MaxiVision chose 48 frames per second is that they can "skip-frame" print to easily convert to 24 fps for general release. There's no easy way to convert 30 fps or 60 fps to 24 fps without risking motion artifacts. (Recall that the 30 fps 65/70mm Todd-AO productions of "Oklahoma!" and "Around the World in 80 Days" were also shot at 24 fps on 35mm film for "regular" 35mm theatres. Later 65/70mm productions reverted to 24 fps).

------------------
John Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Professional Motion Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Eastman Kodak Company
Rochester, NY 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Fax: 716-722-7243


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Greg Anderson
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 766
From: Ogden Valley, Utah
Registered: Nov 1999


 - posted 12-13-1999 04:19 PM      Profile for Greg Anderson   Author's Homepage   Email Greg Anderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I'm forced to conclude that because it will be so simple to convert a MaxiVision 48 film to 24fps, many MaxiVision 48 films will be converted in this manner (assuming that many MaxiVision 48 films will be made in the first place).

So we'll end up with this technology being used at only a few theatres in the largest cities and the vast majority of theatres showing MaxiVision 48 films "the old fashioned way." Within no time, the studios and distributors will lose enthusiasm for the format (assuming they will ever have it to begin with) and, well... as long as they can gross hundreds of millions of dollars with good, old fashioned 24fps 35mm, why bother upgrading the technology? Why bother spending the money to use twice as much film per print? This same mentality has killed 70mm, hasn't it?

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Michael Barry
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 584
From: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Registered: Nov 1999


 - posted 12-13-1999 08:34 PM      Profile for Michael Barry   Email Michael Barry   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It's a valid question...why not just keep at it with 35MM/24fps? It would cost nothing because the infrastructure is already there. I think the question here is: if you're going to go digital, why not go MaxiVision48 instead since it's:

a) MUCH cheaper
b) MUCH better image quality
c) unlike DLP, there is a SYSTEMIC infrastucture and distribution model.

Despite everyone bracing themselves against the onslaught of digital, I don't believe that it's the inevitable, foregone conclusion that everyone seems to feel that it is, just because there are a few prototype sites. There is still no infrastructure and hence no customers.

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George Roher
Master Film Handler

Posts: 266
From: Washington DC
Registered: Jul 99


 - posted 12-14-1999 12:36 AM      Profile for George Roher   Email George Roher   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It's nice that someone who can reach a lot of people is sending out the message that film is good. And I didn't really see anything wrong with Roger's negative comments about today's projectionists. He's absolutely right. Many projectionists don't know what they are doing, he didn't say all. It would have been nice if he had explained that the theatre owners' refusal to pay people who stay in the booth, and lack of interest in what they're putting on screen is the cause of this. But since Roger openly called Mr. Lucas a "propeller head", I'm willing to forgive the article's flaws.


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Christopher Seo
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 530
From: Los Angeles, CA
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 12-14-1999 02:04 AM      Profile for Christopher Seo   Email Christopher Seo   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Okay, here's a logical question: What's preventing conventional projectors from being run at higher frame rates? Wear and tear would be increased, I'd imagine, but what-- would they explode?

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 12-14-1999 07:49 AM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Increasing the speed from 24fps to 30fps would be fairly straight forward (variable speed motor or gear/belt ratio change), and most current projectors would function reliably at a slightly higher frame rate. At Kodak we have several Century projectors equipped with variable speed motors that allow running up to 36fps. The projectors run well at 36fps, but the added noise and vibration are enough to make me believe that that is about the limit before the projectors wear prematurely.

AFAIK, some of the early 60fps ShowScan projectors were specially modified 35/70mm Century JJ projectors, so it's certainly possible to "beef up" a conventional Geneva intermittent projector to run at much higher speeds. Another option that allows very high speed is to use a servo or stepper motor pulldown, such as in the Arriflex Loc-Pro, Pioneer, Cinema Products, Christie Epic, or MaxiVision projectors.

------------------
John Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Professional Motion Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Eastman Kodak Company
Rochester, NY 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Fax: 716-722-7243


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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 12-14-1999 09:49 AM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Even the venerable Super Simplex will run at 48FPS
The major item is mainly a change of lubricant to provide the necassay higherspeed friction reduction
We used to ad STP to XL's that we ran at 48 fps and they stood up

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Trevor Bailey
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 113
From: Woonsocket, RI
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 12-17-1999 03:59 PM      Profile for Trevor Bailey   Author's Homepage   Email Trevor Bailey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I have always been a fan of "bigger, faster, better", so I would very much like to see some of these innovations reach the light of day. But I think we all know there is only one issue holding all of these great possibilities back: money.

When a company builds a "stadium mega-plex" that has digital sound in only two auditoriums...how will they ever try something as fanciful as a new projection technology? They say "the market in this area does not require more digital sound". Hmmm... then that leads us to the market... the customers.

The bottom line is the only thing that will lead to change at the theaters.

I challenge all of the talented and intelligent people in this industry we love:

Find a way to make the customers speak with their wallets: "We want better quality in your presentation!"

That is the only way to make real changes.


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Ian Price
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1714
From: Denver, CO
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 02-24-2002 01:35 PM      Profile for Ian Price   Email Ian Price   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Just bumping this to the top.

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 02-24-2002 01:45 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Gord said
"Even the venerable Super Simplex will run at 48FPS
The major item is mainly a change of lubricant to provide the necassay higherspeed friction reduction
We used to ad STP to XL's that we ran at 48 fps and they stood up"

Hey Gord,
All you needed was the good ole LaVezzi synthetic stuff....your favorite!
Mark @ New GTS

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System Notices
Forum Watchdog / Soup Nazi

Posts: 215

Registered: Apr 2004


 - posted 08-10-2005 09:12 PM      Profile for System Notices         Edit/Delete Post 

It has been 1263 days since the last post.


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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 08-10-2005 09:12 PM      Profile for Mike Blakesley   Author's Homepage   Email Mike Blakesley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Here's more Roger Ebert about Maxivision 48, from his latest Movie Answer Man column (8/7/05).

If the movie industry had true visionaries among its most powerful executives, Maxivision 48 would be given a try. It shows movies at 48 frames a second, uses only 50 percent more film than currently, and because of a patented method for moving the film through the gate, eliminates scratching and jiggles; it would cost only $12,000 per screen to install the equipment. The picture is four times as good as current film projection, and that would provide a powerful incentive for people to see movies in theaters. I've heard genuine enthusiasm from people who've seen movies like "Batman Begins" and "Charlie and the Chocolate Factory" on IMAX screens, and I know that audiences do respond to picture quality. If one industry leader announced a movie in Maxivision, there would be a stampede to the format because digital would be instantly upstaged.

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Mattias Ohlson
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 180
From: Falun, Sweden
Registered: Mar 2003


 - posted 08-11-2005 10:41 AM      Profile for Mattias Ohlson   Email Mattias Ohlson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Why not SDS-70tm?
5/70@48fps and 96Hz flicker rate and bright

http://www.superdimension70.com/articles/wide-screen-article.asp

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