Film-Tech Cinema Systems
Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE


  
my profile | my password | search | faq & rules | forum home
  next oldest topic   next newest topic
» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » Sound systems - Leave'em on or turn'em off? (Page 1)

 
This topic comprises 2 pages: 1  2 
 
Author Topic: Sound systems - Leave'em on or turn'em off?
Rick Long
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 759
From: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Registered: Nov 1999


 - posted 12-04-1999 12:43 PM      Profile for Rick Long   Email Rick Long   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Lately, there has been a growing controversy as to whether it is better to leave the processor and amplifiers powered up overnight, or to shut them off after the last performance.
Both sides seem to have valid arguments; on the pro side; less electrical inrush to the system, solid-state component stabilisation time, ect. The con side argues in favour of damage from heat build-up, premature cooling fan failure, and the invitation for non-qualified personel to tamper with the system, ect.
Your comments on this would be appreciated.

 |  IP: Logged

Ken Layton
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1452
From: Olympia, Wash. USA
Registered: Sep 1999


 - posted 12-04-1999 12:55 PM      Profile for Ken Layton   Email Ken Layton   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I say turn 'em OFF and save on your electric bill. Give the amps a rest and don't bake the components inside.

 |  IP: Logged

Randy Stankey
Film God

Posts: 6539
From: Erie, Pennsylvania
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 12-04-1999 01:07 PM      Profile for Randy Stankey   Email Randy Stankey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I say definately turn the amps off. Heat build up is the number one thing that makes things electronic go bad nowadays. If the amps are fan-cooled then maybe that's not so important.

Number two, is the possibility of voltage spikes. They are sometimes more frequent at night. Furthermore, at least if you're there when one hits, you'll be able to tell what happened. If it's at night, you'll just be scratching your head in the morning.

Okay, if you've got surge suppression that's not an issue. Mercyhurst does and they leave the Media Matrix and the Smart on 24/365. Doesn't hurt 'em a bit. Matter of fact, people say turning them on & off all the time is worse. We just turn the amps off at night.

At TT17, everything goes on in the morning and of at night. (That's over 200 swithces to throw every morning!)

 |  IP: Logged

Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 12-04-1999 02:09 PM      Profile for Scott Norwood   Author's Homepage   Email Scott Norwood   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I usually turned everything off...I used the switches on the amps (which had to go off before the CP-50 to avoid a nasty "pop" that might blow or damage the speakers) and then threw the breaker to the sound rack (which killed the processor, monitor amp, and exciter supplies.

200 switches every morning! Wow!

For the single-screen where I worked, I had to flip breakers for: (1) picture changeover, (2-3) threading lights, (4-5) projector motors, (6) sound rack, (7-8) amps, (9) rewind motor, (10) attic blower, (11-14) lamphouse blowers and rectifiers, and (15-21) knife switches for seven dimmer circuits. This doesn't include booth ceiling lights, etc.

 |  IP: Logged

Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 12-04-1999 02:32 PM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I require that as a condition of warranty on any sound system we install whether it be a theatre or other venue it must be left powered up or don't call us.
The reasons are
1 The capactitors in the Powersupplies require a fairly long time constant to charge fully before a signal should be applied (not true for newer switching supplies)
2 System stays at thermal equilibrium
a solid state amplifier actually takes longer to properly warm up then a tube one does.
3 No possibility of turn on thumps
4 Low inrush current. Most amps draw enough current to trip breakers on turn on
5 Most amps fail on turn on especially there own power switch
6 Find me a professional recording studio that powers their electronics down at night
7 Systems that are left powered up drift less

We usually install a contactor on the mains to a rack so if the power goes down the rack will not power itself up when the hyfro comes back on but must pe manually powered up

There are several sequencers available for that applications

The only amps I have ever replaced have always been where peoiple power up and down

The power bill issue is moot as a rack of amps ideling usually is only about 200 watts

 |  IP: Logged

Stefan Scholz
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 223
From: Schoenberg, Germany
Registered: Sep 1999


 - posted 12-04-1999 02:33 PM      Profile for Stefan Scholz   Author's Homepage   Email Stefan Scholz   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Turn off, when leaving.
Some rteasons, fans are rated for a lifespan of about 10 k hours, so they will pass quicker, you waste electricity for stdby, each Amp. takes about 100 W or so in idle mode, and for fire safety. Unattended equipment might be a fire hazard, rare, but I have seen an amp burning, during intermission.

 |  IP: Logged

John Wilson
Film God

Posts: 5438
From: Sydney, Australia.
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 12-06-1999 05:24 AM      Profile for John Wilson   Email John Wilson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
At our IMAX, the only thing that stays on 24hrs is the sound rack. Amps, ddp player, dubber, switching etc. It never goes off. At my regular theaters though, it's not such an issue. Everything is off before you leave the box except the exhaust fan runs on a delay timer for another 15 minutes.

 |  IP: Logged

Frank Angel
Film God

Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 12-06-1999 09:24 AM      Profile for Frank Angel   Author's Homepage   Email Frank Angel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I agree with Gordon McLeod and John Wilson. Steady-state is always prefered over powering up and down cycles. In our recording studio and the network systems "mother room" (which contains all the servers, telephone digital switch and hub racks) nothing ever gets turned off. The amp racks for the theatre sound system in the amp room (which is separate from the projection booth), never gets turned off. Normally I would think amps might fare better if they were off when not in use only because they generate a good amount of heat, but our amp room is kept so cold and the amps have internal fans, that internal overheating is not a problem. In our TV production facility, it's the same -- everything stays on 24hrs.

The item of note, however, is that, as I said, these rooms all have very hefty temperature control systems. The temperature is always at an unconfortable 65 degrees in the amp and network systems rooms. The network systems room even has thermometers that read the ambient temp inside the servers and sensors will down a server if it rises above a certain preset.

The projection booth is air conditioned, but we read incoming mains voltages as high as 130V at night, so we shut the processor rack down. It wouldn't be uncommon to come in and find four or five hall light bulbs that are always on, burned out over night....not a good omen. Plus, we don't run film on a daily basis. Given this, I decided not to leave the sound racks on. Last week I got a Triplite power conditioner that will regulate the power to the processor racks.

In the museum booth, some contractor convinced them to install a power conditioner -- it is the size of house. I have no idea why. It stands 6ft tall, 3 ft deep and 4 ft wide. It gives off more noise than the projectors, but worse, it pours HEAT into the booth. That booth, even though it has air conditioning, is always hot -- I mean like 80 degrees all the time. It's a bitch to work and certainly it can't be good for equipment to be left powered in that environment. Everything in that booth goes off at night.

As for all those switches....consider investing in X10 controls-- it's the best thing we ever did. From a single location at the booth entrance, one button can shut everything off -- lights, racks, coffee maker(!!), everything. You can even get a timer controler and set the thing to shut everything down after say 1am. This way, even it a newbie forgets to turn of the single switch, the timer will shut it down for you. The receiver modules only run about $11 and the control box about $9. There is no longer any missed swithes or that 20 min demonstration for newbies coming into the booth for the first time where you have to show him each and every switch.


 |  IP: Logged

Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 12-06-1999 12:21 PM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
In a couple of large instalations we installed the racks to be part of the return air plenum
I always put insurge protectors on the processors. In some cases I will put a UPS on the processor to makesure in an emergancy it will power down last

 |  IP: Logged

Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99


 - posted 12-06-1999 01:02 PM      Profile for Brad Miller   Author's Homepage   Email Brad Miller       Edit/Delete Post 
Frank, those X10 units are pretty convenient. You can even buy modules to send a pulse or close a relay to start projectors from a clock timer or have a wireless remote control.

I've always shut everything down at night. Amps go off first, then after they die the rest is powered down. Reverse that for powering up.

 |  IP: Logged

Jason Burroughs
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 654
From: Allen, TX
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 12-06-1999 03:59 PM      Profile for Jason Burroughs   Email Jason Burroughs   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I'd imagine the debate could go on and on here, just as it has in the PC word... The MTBF on electronics is large now that there isn't much difference either way. At the theatres I've worked at we've always turned everything off, pretty much the same manner that Brad uses, and provided that ambiant temperature and air circulation remain fairly constant and within the products specifications leaving them on shouldn't be a problem. Howerver most theatres turn off the HVA/C systems during the night, I would imagine that this would cause heat to build up in the projection room, not only putting stress on the equipment while it bakes overnight, but on the HVA/C system it self when it kicks back in in the morning. Server rooms have carefully controlled air handlers that conrtoll temperature, airborne dirt, humidity, etc... I've yet to see a projection booth that has air handling on this level.

 |  IP: Logged

William Hooper
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1879
From: Mobile, AL USA
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 12-06-1999 10:00 PM      Profile for William Hooper   Author's Homepage   Email William Hooper   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
Last week I got a Triplite power conditioner that will regulate the power to the processor racks.

Is it a monster isolation transformer? I humped one of those up to the booth last year to cut some line noise. Hauling that brick annoyed me more than the pedestals & rectifiers.

Furman's got a box that looks really nice: http://www.furmansound.com/IT-Series.html



 |  IP: Logged

Stephen Jones
Master Film Handler

Posts: 314
From: Geelong Victoria Australia
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 01-09-2000 06:44 PM      Profile for Stephen Jones   Email Stephen Jones   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I prefer to turn the amps on at the start of the day and turn them off at the end of the day.I dont like the idea of leaving amps on over night.

------------------

 |  IP: Logged

Reeve Byrne
Film Handler

Posts: 35
From: Anchorage, Ak USA
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 01-13-2000 08:31 AM      Profile for Reeve Byrne   Email Reeve Byrne   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I was alwasy told to turn everything off at night. "It saves money in utility cost" is what one person told me.

 |  IP: Logged

Tim Reed
Better Projection Pays

Posts: 5246
From: Northampton, PA
Registered: Sep 1999


 - posted 01-13-2000 09:44 AM      Profile for Tim Reed   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Off... turn 'em off.

With apologies and a tip o' the hat to Gordon; show me a broadcast facility that leaves everything on (when they sign-off).

As long as we're comparing apples and oranges.


 |  IP: Logged



All times are Central (GMT -6:00)
This topic comprises 2 pages: 1  2 
 
   Close Topic    Move Topic    Delete Topic    next oldest topic   next newest topic
 - Printer-friendly view of this topic
Hop To:



Powered by Infopop Corporation
UBB.classicTM 6.3.1.2

The Film-Tech Forums are designed for various members related to the cinema industry to express their opinions, viewpoints and testimonials on various products, services and events based upon speculation, personal knowledge and factual information through use, therefore all views represented here allow no liability upon the publishers of this web site and the owners of said views assume no liability for any ill will resulting from these postings. The posts made here are for educational as well as entertainment purposes and as such anyone viewing this portion of the website must accept these views as statements of the author of that opinion and agrees to release the authors from any and all liability.

© 1999-2020 Film-Tech Cinema Systems, LLC. All rights reserved.